SCOBA & Roman Catholic Agreed Statement On the Filioque

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Ephraem
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Post by Ephraem »

Rome will probably not give up their Filioque, nonetheless they have acknowledged the definitive (or as they say, conciliar and normative) nature of the Niceno-Constantinopolitan Creed over and above their tampered version.

From the Historical Section (which I found useful) of the Agreed Statement:

the Vatican published the document “The Greek and Latin Traditions Regarding the Procession of the Holy Spirit” (September 13, 1995). ... the text says: “The Catholic Church acknowledges the conciliar, ecumenical, normative and irrevocable value, as the expression of one common faith of the Church and of all Christians, of the Symbol professed in Greek at Constantinople in 381 by the Second Ecumenical Council. No confession of faith peculiar to a particular liturgical tradition can contradict this expression of faith taught and professed by the undivided Church.

I suppose when they say "no confession of faith peculiar to a particular liturgical tradition can contradict this expression of faith taught and professed by the undivided Church" they imply that there is no theological distortion resulting from their use of the Filioque.

The Agreed Statement
http://www.scoba.us/resources/filioque-p01.asp

Ephraem
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Stepanov
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Post by Stepanov »

In related news:

Diver Negotiates With Giant Jellyfish

A diminutive diver apparently attempted to charm a gigantic Portuguese Man-Of-War Tuesday off the coast of South Africa. Observers said the diver could be seen smiling and gesticulating at the ten-times-man-sized jellyfish as it stung him repeatedly with its tentacles before finally devouring him.

"He spoke to the monster in the most conciliatory terms," said Constance Council, a local bait-cutter. "It looked as though he was sort of mesmerized by the thing's size, its obvious symmetry and efficiency of motion, and its beautiful purple color. The poor bloke was still grinning stupidly as the blob digested him. It was horrible!"

"I guess he thought his wetsuit would protect him," said fisherman Frank Nernest, " but it didn't."

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Maria
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Post by Maria »

Stepanov wrote:

In related news:

Diver Negotiates With Giant Jellyfish

A diminutive diver apparently attempted to charm a gigantic Portuguese Man-Of-War Tuesday off the coast of South Africa. Observers said the diver could be seen smiling and gesticulating at the ten-times-man-sized jellyfish as it stung him repeatedly with its tentacles before finally devouring him.

"He spoke to the monster in the most conciliatory terms," said Constance Council, a local bait-cutter. "It looked as though he was sort of mesmerized by the thing's size, its obvious symmetry and efficiency of motion, and its beautiful purple color. The poor bloke was still grinning stupidly as the blob digested him. It was horrible!"

"I guess he thought his wetsuit would protect him," said fisherman Frank Nernest, " but it didn't."

Did you find this news bulletin on snopes.com? Is this story for real?

I have studied the Portugese Man of War in my biology classes and this primitive floating collection of stinging cells is known to kill people.

It's interesting how you make a subtle comparison here, as 95% of rattlesnake venom is good protein while only 5 percent is poison. But that 5% can kill.

And then I got bit by a newborn black widow spider - it was barely visible on my hand. The drop of poison injected wasn't even visible perhaps the size of a human egg. Yet that poison paralyzed me and sent me to the ICU for 24 hours and I was sick for 2 months with headaches. I could have died if I hadn't received the anti-venom in time, but my neighbor saved my life by taking me to the emergency room.

Yours in Christ,
Maria (delete the m :mrgreen: )

Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy on me a sinner.

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Ephraem
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Post by Ephraem »

There was a priest on EWTN last week (on the Abundant Life program) who said that the Holy Spirit only works through the heart of Mary... at least that is how I understood him.

... who proceeds from the Father and the Son and His Mother... apparently. Those crazy Catholics!

Ephraem
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Nikodemus
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Condemned by popes

Post by Nikodemus »

This is a good argument against heretical catholics in the west:

According to the First Vatican Council the Pope is Infallible when he speaks ex cathedra on faith and morals. This infallibility also means that a pope never CAN lead the flock of Christ wrong.

Pope Leo III condemned filioque and wrote the creed in the basilica of St Peter both in greek and latin without the filioque adding the words: HAEC LEO POSUI AMORE ET CAUTELA FIDEI ORTHODOXAE. This have I leo, put down in love and to the protection of, the orthodox faith. This was his reaction agaisnt filioque. Later John VIII condemnet it by letter to Patrairch Photius calling him a JUDAS who first introduced filioque to the CREED.

Therefore, if a pope cannot lead his flock on the worng path, either those pope who bessed filioue are not popes, or...the papacy itself is wrong? In either case, you cannot be catholic.

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Stepanov
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Post by Stepanov »

Ephraem wrote:

There was a priest on EWTN last week (on the Abundant Life program) who said that the Holy Spirit only works through the heart of Mary... at least that is how I understood him.

... who proceeds from the Father and the Son and His Mother... apparently. Those crazy Catholics!

Mariolatry is a problem for the Latins that very few Orthodox notice.

We always view accusations of it as suspiciously "Protestant."

But the Romans really have exalted the Theotokos beyond what is proper.

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Post by 尼古拉前执事 »

Orthodox-Catholic Theological Consultation Held Its 69th Meeting
http://www.goarch.org/en/news/NewsDetail.asp?id=1474

November 1, 2005

The North American Orthodox-Catholic Theological Consultation held its 69th meeting from October 20 to 22, 2005, in Washington, DC. It took place on the campus of Georgetown University, and was co-chaired by Archbishop Daniel Pilarczyk of Cincinnati and Bishop Savas of Troas, the Chancellor of the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese. Bishop Savas substituted for Metropolitan Maximos of Pittsburgh who is still recovering from a recent fall.

The session began with a public lecture by Brian Daley, SJ, the Catholic co-secretary of the consultation, in Dahlgren Chapel on Thursday afternoon. Entitled “Forty Years of Orthodox-Catholic Relations,” Fr Daley outlined the history and significance of the consultation’s achievements in recent decades. The lecture was given in memory of Fr John Long, SJ, a member of the consultation since 1980, who died in September. The President of Georgetown University, Dr. John J. DeGioia, introduced Fr. Daley before he spoke and afterwards hosted the Consultation and guests for a dinner in Riggs Library. In his remarks before dinner, Dr. DeGioia congratulated the Consultation on its 40th anniversary, noted several important decisions it has made in that time, and cited Cardinal Cassidy's compliment in 2000 that the work of this Consultation is a "vital assistance in taking the work of the International Dialogue ahead."

The Consultation continued its reflection on primacies and conciliarity in the Church, beginning at the first theological session with an examination of two texts. The first was the 1991 Agreed Statement of the Orthodox-Catholic dialogue in France entitled, “The Roman Primacy Within the Communion of Churches,” and the second was an article by Jean-Marie Tillard, “The Mission of the Bishop of Rome: What is Essential, What is Expected?” In the second theological session, the consultation heard a paper by Rev Thomas FitzGerald, “The Orthodox-Oriental Orthodox Theological Dialogue,” and one by Rev Ronald Roberson, “The Contemporary Relationship of the Catholic Church with the Oriental Orthodox Churches and the Assyrian Church of the East.” At the third theological session, held on Saturday morning, Rev Nicholas Apostola presented a paper entitled “Primacy in a Pluralistic Context.”

The Consultation also had its usual Information Session on Friday evening. Items presented included the presence of a delegation from the Ecumenical Patriarchate in Rome in June, the announcement of readiness of the Orthodox Church to resume the International Dialogue, and the September meeting of Orthodox participants in the dialogue at the Ecumenical Patriarchate; developments in relations between the Moscow Patriarchate and the Russian Orthodox Church Outside of Russia, including the agreed statement of the two churches entitled “Relations with the Heterodox”; the transfer of the headquarters of the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church from Lviv to Kiev; the withdrawal of the Antiochian Archdiocese from the National Council of Churches; the election of Patriarch Theophilos III of Jerusalem; developments in SCOBA; the possible visit of Pope Benedict XVI to Constantinople; and the inclusion of two Greek Catholics in the “Synaxis of the Carpathian Saints” issued by Metropolitan Nicholas of the American Carpatho-Russian Orthodox Diocese of the USA.

The members of the Consultation attended a Catholic Mass in Dahlgren Chapel at noon on October 21, presided over by Archbishop Pilarczyk.
After the Mass, the Orthodox members of the Consultation celebrated a memorial service in memory of the late John Long, SJ.

Four new members of the Consultation were welcomed at this meeting. The two new Orthodox members are Dr. John Barnet, Associate Professor of New Testament at St. Vladimir’s Orthodox Seminary in Crestwood, New York; and Rev Dr Theodore Pulcini, Associate Professor of Religion at Dickinson College in Carlisle, Pennsylvania. The two new Catholic members are Sr Susan K. Wood, SCL, Professor in the Department of Theology at Marquette University; and Mr Vito Nicastro, Associate Director of the Office for Ecumenical and Interreligious Affairs of the Archdiocese of Boston.

In addition to the two co-chairmen, the other Orthodox members of the Consultation include Father Thomas FitzGerald (Secretary), Father Nicholas Apostola, Prof. Susan Ashbrook Harvey, Father James Dutko, Prof. Paul Meyendorff, Father Alexander Golitzin, Dr. Robert Haddad, Father Paul Schnierla, Father Robert Stephanopoulos, and Bishop Dimitrios of Xanthos, General Secretary of SCOBA (staff). The additional Catholic members are Father Brian Daley, SJ (secretary), Prof. Thomas Bird, Father Peter Galadza, Msgr. John D. Faris, Father John Galvin, Father Sidney Griffith, ST, Father Joseph Komonchak, Father David Petras, and Father Ronald Roberson, CSP (staff).

The 70th meeting of the Consultation is due to take place from June 5 to 7, 2006, in Boston.

The North American Orthodox-Catholic Theological Consultation is sponsored jointly by the Standing Conference of Canonical Orthodox Bishops in the Americas (SCOBA), the Bishops' Committee for Ecumenical and Interreligious Affairs of the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops (USCCB), and the Canadian Conference of Catholic Bishops. Since its establishment in 1965, the Consultation has now issued 22 agreed statements on various topics. All these texts are now available on the website of the USCCB at: http://www.usccb.org/seia/dialogues.htm and on the SCOBA website at: http://www.scoba.us/resources/index.asp

Contact:
SCOBA General Secretariat
8 East 79th Street
New York, NY 10021

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