Father Seraphim Rose on "Traditionalist" groups

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Pensees
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Father Seraphim Rose on "Traditionalist" groups

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Judging from the way things were going, Fr. Seraphim predicted that the super-correct group would eventually stage a schism and end up as a narrow, isolated sect of its own. In his letters over the years, he stated this many times:

June 15, 1976: "The 'right wing' of Orthodoxy will probably be divided into many small 'jurisdictions' in future, most of them anathematizing and fighting with the others.... We must keep up the living contact with the older Russian clergy, even if some of them may seem to us a little too 'liberal'—otherwise we will be lost in the 'zealot' jungle which is growing up around us!"40
July 8, 1980: "We ourselves have felt for some time that Fr. ——— and others who share his attitude are heading straight for a schism, which now seems almost inevitable if he does not change his direction. Such a schism nobody needs; there are so many groups of 'correct' Orthodox in Greece now (none in communion with the others) that a new group will only prove the devil's power to divide Orthodox Christians."41

October 27, 1980: "I look with pain and sadness on this whole situation; ... but I am powerless to do anything about it.... The inevitable schism which they are now preparing (if they don't change soon) will be the last step in a process which only they can change."42

September 17, 1981: "Judging from the last outburst, the schism is close, and I'm afraid the 'silent majority' of our priests and laymen will only heave a sigh of relief when the troublemakers are gone—leaving behind them a bad harvest of ill will, and continuing their name-calling and hatred in a louder tone from their new 'jurisdiction.'

"May God preserve us from all of this! Please forgive my frankness, but I feel the time is very late, and anyone who can do anything had better do it now. I know God will continue to preserve His Church and I believe He will prosper the true Orthodox mission which is just beginning in our Church.... But the tragedy of souls caught in a self-willed schism will be incalculable."43

December 8, 1981: "How tragic that some are now leading their flocks (albeit still very small flocks) out of communion with the only people who can still teach them what Orthodoxy is and help them to wake up from their fantasies of a 'super-correct' Orthodoxy that exists nowhere in the world."44

Not long after Fr. Seraphim's repose, his prediction unfortunately came true just as he had written.

"All this will pass, like some horrible nightmare,"45 Fr. Seraphim remarked in a letter. Looking back at his support of the super-correct group in previous years, he wrote: "We feel ourselves badly betrayed.... All these years we trusted that they were of one mind and soul with us, giving everything they had for the cause of the English-speaking mission. But really, it seems that all this time they were only building for their own glory, cruelly abusing the trust of our simple Russian bishops, priests, and laymen....46 We fear that all our articles about 'zealotry' in the past years have helped to produce a monster!"47

Of course, there was disillusionment on both sides. The leaders of the new party, having been inspired to take up the zealot position in the first place largely thanks to the Platina fathers, assumed that the fathers would naturally join their movement and begin to take their directives from the Boston monastery. Some of them were truly disappointed when it became clear that the fathers were not going to follow their line. They had thought that Fr. Seraphim wanted absolute strictness just like they did, but in this they were wrong. Fr. Seraphim wanted Truth, which is on a deeper level altogether. "They have built a church career for themselves," Fr. Seraphim wrote, "on a false but attractive premise: that the chief danger to the Church today is lack of strictness. No—the chief danger is something much deeper—the loss of the savor of Orthodoxy, a movement in which they themselves are participating, even in their 'strictness.'... 'Strictness' will not save us if we don't have any more the feeling and taste of Orthodoxy."48
http://www.orthodoxinfo.com/ecumenism/fsr_63.aspx

I know the affinity that Old Calendarists have for Father Seraphim Rose, and how they are willing to use him to support their beliefs, but I seriously doubt that he would have supported breaking oneself off from "World Orthodoxy." I may sound hypocritical as a non-Chalcedonian in making light of this, and you'd be perfectly justified in thinking so, but I'm honestly bewildered when Father Seraphim is used to promote something which he would have never approved of in the first place.

Peace.

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Post by jckstraw72 »

i just finished his bio....and i completely agree with you.

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Post by 尼古拉前执事 »

He was in ROCOR when they were in communion with only the GOC. He said that Jordanville was the last truly Orthodox Seminary left in America and he did not know how long it would even stand as that. He definitely was not for being part of World Orthodoxy, even if his recently rewritten and ecumenically bio was made to be spun that way.

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Post by spiridon »

Yes some would like to think that Fr.Seraphim Rose of blessed memory would leave rocor upon communion with MP and world Orthdox, but the fact remains that Fr.Seraphim is at rest and he never mentioned that and his appearances today have never given any messages of that topic...I know almost a dozen Priests within Rocor and a couple of other Orthodox jurisdictions out here in san francisco who lived with Fr.Seraphim in Platina and they are following with the union...
I think that Fr.Seraphim would be be our Archbishop today, had he Survived...and unfortunately probally wouldnt have been with Fr.Herman...if you look at the people and there spirit, those who were closer to Fr.Herman are those in Rocie,Greek old calendars and others, and those who were close to Fr.Seraphim remained in the church Abroad...

First, and Last, and Always
in CHRIST

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Post by jckstraw72 »

Fr. Seraphim never denied grace in the MP or other "world" jurisdictions. he also opposed rebaptising ppl who came to ROCOR from other jurisdictions. he also wrote quite warmly of Fr. Dimitry Dudko of the MP, who, if i remember correctly, he dedicated an issue of the Orthodox Word to. as a priest, Fr. Seraphim also communed ppl from "world" jurisdictions in his later years. he wrote and spoke a great deal about how Orthodoxy of the heart is far more important than strict legalism. he was against ecumenism and the new calendar and all that, but he never let it override simplicity of heart. he even sorrowed over the zealous articles he printed in early issues of the Orthodox Word bc he felt it led to a monster with the monastery in Boston and the super-correct faction in ROCOR and in other jurisdictions.

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Post by Pensees »

jckstraw72 wrote:

Fr. Seraphim never denied grace in the MP or other "world" jurisdictions. he also opposed rebaptising ppl who came to ROCOR from other jurisdictions. he also wrote quite warmly of Fr. Dimitry Dudko of the MP, who, if i remember correctly, he dedicated an issue of the Orthodox Word to. as a priest, Fr. Seraphim also communed ppl from "world" jurisdictions in his later years. he wrote and spoke a great deal about how Orthodoxy of the heart is far more important than strict legalism. he was against ecumenism and the new calendar and all that, but he never let it override simplicity of heart. he even sorrowed over the zealous articles he printed in early issues of the Orthodox Word bc he felt it led to a monster with the monastery in Boston and the super-correct faction in ROCOR and in other jurisdictions.

I couldn't agree with you more.

Peace.

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Post by GOCTheophan »

jckstraw72 wrote:

i just finished his bio....and i completely agree with you.

The Not of this World book? Beware! Do you know the history of Fr Herman after Fr Seraphim's death? How their St Hermans Brotherhood press have edited out the endorsement of the GOC and the Catacombniks? That book is basically a justification of Fr Hermans wanderings and wonderings.

That evil book kept me in the MP for too long. Whatever people might say thats where Kyprianism leads- its the only Church around and it must still have Grace therefore even though they Commune RCs, Monophysites, etc and preach heresy from the Royal Doors I will continue to go...You might even say like I did that such "tolerance" was suffering for the Church! LOL! Thats why it is important for the zealots of True Orthodoxy to expose people Justin Popovich who are held up as pillars of Orthodoxy.

If you want to talk about the greatest example of "super-correctness" well Lazar Puoahla is in OCA now, I think that says it all...This disortion of was meant by the words "super correctness" is all part of the terrible revisionism that is happening.

Theophan.

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