Death & dying

Ekaterina · Post by **Ekaterina** » Thu 31 March 2005 8:36 am

Over the last few weeks we have all been inundated with the the circus surrounding the life and death of Terri Schiavo. It got me to thinking about the Orthodox stance on death and dying, especially in no hope cases or the death of an elderly person.

Othodox teaching tells us we need to fight for every breath, yet there is little to guide one in cases where death is inevitable, where the fight really yields no hope, where the damamge caused yields no hope as in an accident. I doubt that the early church fathers ever had to deal with issues that face us today. and so we are left with questions such as ..... Do we give in to medical advances that prolong life in hopeless conditions? DO we let them hook us up and keep us artificially alive?

I have my own experiences, including the whole feeding tube deal, but I would like to hear what others have to say before I tell of my experience...

Katya

ania · Post by **ania** » Thu 31 March 2005 9:48 am

My grandfather, after serveral strokes was in the hospital in a state from which we knew he would never recover. His lungs were filling with water, and his brain functions had pretty much stopped. When my grandmother was given the choice to either hook him up to machines for God only knows how long or to let him die in peace soon after taking his last communion, she let him go.
It was the right thing to do in that case, as Dyed Nikolai was 88 years old, had lived a full life, and he would not have appreciated having to stick around the earthly world when he could be with God.
However, my personal opinion on Terry Shaivo is that her parents should be given custody, she should be given physical theropy and all that other stuff she's been denied for the past 15 years, and see what happens.

Maria · Post by **Maria** » Thu 31 March 2005 12:30 pm

Terri has passed to life eternal hopefully.

May she rest in peace.

In my college studies to be a Speech Language Pathologist, we have discussed these issues. The human body has a remarkable ability to recover when given a chance.

However Terri wasn't given a chance to be rehabilitated, which has happened with other patients. Terri's husband never wanted her to have that chance. He refused her a divorce while she was still able bodied, then refused her a divorce while she was disabled even though he was living in adultery with another woman and had fathered children out of wedlock.

According to the Orthodox Church, doesn't adultery terminate a marriage.

Michael is living a lie. His salvation is at risk. He is the one to be pitied.

Ephraem · Post by **Ephraem** » Thu 31 March 2005 4:43 pm

Excessive artificial prolongation of life is not good stewardship. Using science to force a body to continue living when, in fact, that person is ready to die is a supreme abuse of medicine.

Adultry does not terminate a marriage, although it is grounds for divorce.

To say Michael didn't do anything for Terri is just wrong. Before you judge him, try to learn the facts. She was given intensive therapy and a variety of treatments for the first 6 or 7 years of her lapse in the persistant vegetative state. Her brain has been deteriorating since 1990; her cerebral cortex is basically gone, replaced by cerebral spinal fluid. Nobody home, lights out, on permanent vacation.

Custody should remain with the spouse and not the parents. With marriage a man and woman become one flesh and forge a bond that supersedes that which they had with their parents. "The wife does not have authority over her own body, but the husband does." - 1 Corinthians 7:4

jacqueline · Post by **jacqueline** » Thu 31 March 2005 9:48 pm

First, I agree with Maria...

Also, let me add that the word "hopeless" should not be used when there is still life left within a person. All life has value until the last breath is taken. Where there is life, there is hope.... and miracles CAN happen that defy any "scientific" knowledge, if it is the will of God.

An excerpt from a new article on illness posted at FatherAlexander.org reads:

When St. Basil the Great was asked if going to a doctor and taking medicine were in keeping with ways of piety, he replied:

"Every art is God's gift to us, making up for what is lacking in nature....After we were told to return to the earth from which we had come [at the time of the Fall], and were joined to a pain-ridden flesh that is destined to die, and made subject to disease because of sin, the science of medicine was given to us by God in order to relieve sickness, if only to a small degree (The Long Rules).

"And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you." -- Matthew 17:20

Maria · Post by **Maria** » Fri 1 April 2005 12:36 am

We are being severely attacked today by the demons of hatred and discord. On every Internet Forum that I have visited there is bitterness and cruelity. People are unregistering or self-deleting their memberships. I found this on 4 boards today (including this one). Could it be in part a result of the cruel death of Terri? For every action, there is an opposite and equal reaction. And that sin has a cosmic effect on all of us. And I am speaking of Michael's evil deeds - his adultery and the murder of his wife.

TomS · Post by **TomS** » Fri 1 April 2005 12:42 am

I don't think it is any different than normal.