Hey Bush Voters, Look at what ye hath wrought!

The resting place of threads that were very valid in 2004, but not so much in 2024. Basically this is a giant historical archive.


plani
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Hey Bush Voters, Look at what ye hath wrought!

Post by plani »

What' W's got in store for the world:

Excerpts from an address to the Society of Professional Journalists 2004 National Convention, September 11, 2004

The Rapture Index and the U.S. election

How do we explain the possibility that a close election ... could turn on several million good and decent citizens who believe in the Rapture Index? That's what I said ­ the Rapture Index. Google it and you will understand why the best-selling books in America today are the twelve volumes of the Left Behind series which have earned multi-millions of dollars for their co-authors who earlier this year completed a triumphant tour of the Bible Belt whose buckle holds in place George W. Bush's armour of the Lord. These true believers subscribe to a fantastical theology concocted in the l9th century by a couple of immigrant preachers who took disparate passages from the Bible and wove them into a narrative millions of people believe to be literally true.

According to this narrative, Jesus will return to earth only when certain conditions are met: when Israel has been established as a state; when Israel then occupies the rest of its "biblical lands;" when the third temple has been rebuilt on the site now occupied by the Dome of the Rock and Al-Aqsa mosques; and, then, when legions of the Antichrist attack Israel. This will trigger a final showdown in the valley of Armageddon during which all the Jews who have not converted will be burned. Then the Messiah returns to earth. The Rapture occurs once the big battle begins. "True believers" will be lifted out of their clothes and transported to heaven where, seated next to the right hand of God, they will watch their political and religious opponents suffer plagues of boils, sores, locusts and frogs during the several years of tribulation which follow.

I'm not making this up. We've reported on these people for our weekly broadcast on PBS, following some of them from Texas to the West Bank. They are sincere, serious, and polite as they tell you that they feel called to help bring the Rapture on as fulfillment of biblical prophecy. That's why they have declared solidarity with Israel and the Jewish settlements and backed up their support with money and volunteers. It's why they have staged confrontations at the old temple site in Jerusalem. It's why the invasion of Iraq for them was a warm-up act, predicted in the 9th chapter of the Book of Revelations where four angels "which are bound in the great river Euphrates" will be released "to slay the third part of men." As the British writer George Monbiot has pointed out, for these people the Middle East is not a foreign policy issue, it's a biblical scenario, a matter of personal belief. A war with Islam in the Middle East is not something to be feared but welcomed; if there's a conflagration there, they come out winners on the far side of tribulation, inside the pearly gates, in celestial splendor, supping on ambrosia to the accompaniment of harps plucked by angels.

One estimate puts these people at about l5 per cent of the electorate. Most are likely to vote Republican; they are part of the core of George W. Bush's base support. He knows who they are and what they want. When the President asked Ariel Sharon to pull his tanks out of Jenin in 2002, over one hundred thousand angry Christian fundamentalists barraged the White House with emails and Mr. Bush never mentioned the matter again.

Not coincidentally, the administration recently put itself solidly behind Ariel Sharon's expansions of settlements on the West Bank. In George Monbiot's analysis, the President stands to lose fewer votes by encouraging Israeli expansion into the West Bank than he stands to lose by restraining it. "He would be mad to listen to these people, but he would also be mad not to." No wonder Karl Rove walks around the West Wing whistling "Onward Christian Soldiers." He knows how many votes he is likely to get from these pious folk who believe that the Rapture Index now stands at 144 --- just one point below the critical threshold at which point the prophecy is fulfilled, the whole thing blows, the sky is filled with floating naked bodies, and the true believers wind up at the right hand of God. With no regret for those left behind. (See George Monbiot. The Guardian, April 20, 2004.)

I know, I know: You think I am bonkers... But this is just the point: Journalists who try to tell these stories, connect these dots, and examine these links are demeaned, disparaged, and dismissed. This is the very kind of story that illustrates the challenge journalists face in a world driven by ideologies that are stoutly maintained despite being contradicted by what is generally accepted as reality.

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George Australia
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Re: Hey Bush Voters, Look at what ye hath wrought!

Post by George Australia »

plani wrote:

This is the very kind of story that illustrates the challenge journalists face in a world driven by ideologies that are stoutly maintained despite being contradicted by what is generally accepted as reality.

No, this is the very kind of story which illustrates the bias, distortion of truth and political agenda behind the modern media.
Tell me, why did you choose the title of this thread that you chose? Was it because of your adherence to the values of unbiased journalism? and because you refuse to be "driven by ideology"? If I were a US citizen, I would not have voted for George Bush, but nor would I attempt to infer that those who did are supporters of protestant nutcases and their rapture theories.
The only thing which this article shows is that, like politicians, the media cannot be trusted to tell the truth.

"As long as it depends on Monothelitism, then Miaphysitism is nothing but a variant of Monophysitism."

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Justin
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Post by Justin »

I DID vote, and conservatively (Constitution Party), and let me tell you, there's more to that story than you'd think.

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George Australia
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Post by George Australia »

Justin wrote:

I DID vote, and conservatively (Constitution Party), and let me tell you, there's more to that story than you'd think.

Let me speak for a moment as a businessman...
[businessman mode]Like many of my fellow Greeks in the diaspora, I run a business. Rule #1 of business would have to be: "To hold one's toungue is neither denial nor acceptance." I'm not saying that those who believe in the apocalyptic role of the US wouldn't vote for Bush, of course they would. What I am saying is that Bush is a shrewd politician (who must surely be part Greek!) who wouldn't say anything to dissuade the "protestant majority" vote.
Until he says that the war in Iraq (and it is a war) is meant to usher in the apocalypse, we can't assume anything about his motivation for it, other than it was surely an error of judgement. To start attaching apocalyptic motivations to it blurs the truth, and, in a way, absolves those who started this invasion and war of responsibility for it.
I don't see a nutcase, I see a clever politician.
If Bush was wrong (and I believe he was) to order the invasion of Iraq, then there is an Eye which sees everything, and an Ear which hears everything to Whom he will answer. But top marks to his political cunning! [/businessman mode]

"As long as it depends on Monothelitism, then Miaphysitism is nothing but a variant of Monophysitism."

plani
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Bush’s Global War on Christians

Post by plani »

Evil days ahead.

Check this out:

Bush’s Global War on Christians
by Glen Chancy (Greek Orthodox)
http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig3/chancy5.html

plani
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Post by plani »

Political analysts and pundits have arrived at the conclusion that the huge turn-out of evangelical protestants who won the election for W were primarily motivated by fear (terror) and "moral issues."

Why else (they ask) would these people vote against their own self-interests (i.e. economy, jobs, healthcare)? Why , they are good Christian moralists!

As Justin noted, there is much more to this story .

These evangelicals believe that they are now in the position to precipitate the second and third comings of Christ by igniting a wider and bloodier Middle East conflagration. Who cares about personal and economic issues when the Second Coming can be brought about?

May God save us from these heretics and have mercy on the souls of the
innocents who will be killed.

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George Australia
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Post by George Australia »

plani wrote:

May God save us from these heretics and have mercy on the souls of the innocents who will be killed.

You may know that Father Seraphim Rose of blessed memory quoted several times in his writings the prophecy of the clairvoyant Elder Ignatio of Harbin in Manchuria, who in the 1930's had said:
"What began in Russia will end in America."
I had a Russian friend I used to visit in a Greek Orthodox Aged Care Home who was 99 yrs old in 1989 when I met him, who had seen the Bolsheviks take over Russia, fled to Manchuria and then Australia in 1946. He would dictate his memoirs to me, and I would type them. I had known nothing of Russia but the Communist USSR when I was growing up. Then, suddenly, the great miracle of the end of Communism came on the Kyriopascha (the rare concurrence of the Feast of the Annunciation and Pascha- the last time this occurred was 1821- the Romaiko-Greek Uprising which ended 400 years of Ottoman rule). My Russian friend, Michael, had lived to see the rise and fall of Communism. He too, knew of the prophecy of Elder Ignatio (who was his Spiritual Father), and it was the reason he chose to flee to Australia rather than the US. My friend Michael fell asleep in the Lord aged 103.
"What began in Russia will end in America." History has shown us that all earthly kingdoms rise and fall, no matter how great they become. The US is no different. "National Security" and "National Interest" have become false gods from which no sacrifice is witheld- even any notion of human dignity- as we see from Guantanamo Bay and Abu Ghraib.
The problem is not just the protestant evangelicals. And do not think that Orthodoxy can 'save' the US 'kingdom' from falling- it didn't save Constantinople or Moscow.
Nor could Kerry nor any one else winning the election prevent this- we have a saying back home in Greece (the birthplace of democracy): "The fish rots from both it's head and it's gut"
In all this, we should remember: there is a God Who sees and hears all, and Who loves the works of His Hands with a boundless love and an abyss of mercy.
Even if "what began in Russia will end in America" it is still "better to trust in the Lord than put confidence in man. It is better to trust the Lord than to put confidence in princes." (Psalm 117 8-9 )
En XP,
George

"As long as it depends on Monothelitism, then Miaphysitism is nothing but a variant of Monophysitism."

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