Latest Ecumenical Liturgy

[Methodius]

A friend sent me a link to http://www.novusordowatch.org/aachen.htm which describes a Roman Catholic Mass by many cardinals where it was pronounced by one of the cardinals that, "When we are praying for peace, we are turning to the one God. We know: God is not Catholic , God is not Protestant, God is not Orthodox, God is not even Christian. God is not Jewish. God is not Muslim, God is not Buddhist. God is not the God of one or the other religion."

God is not Christian? God is not the God of one or the other religion?

Bad enough?

The second homily was by the Greek-Orthodox Metropolitan of Germany, Augoustinos. He preached from a Roman Catholic altar! I should not be surprised since Roman Catholics and Greek New Calendarists concelebrate, but going along with God not being Christian or the God of any religion?

[Joe Zollars]

Please, this is a Novus Ordo service, and therefore it is highly inapropriate to call it a Mass as there is no hope for validity in Novus Ordo Sacraments.

Novus Ordo "catholic" + World "orthodox"= Novus Ordo Saeculorum (New World Order)

Joe Zollars

[OrthodoxyOrDeath]

Joe,

I can certainly appreciate your equation: "Novus Ordo "catholic" + World "orthodox"= Novus Ordo Saeculorum (New World Order)

And I have heard the word "valid" used enough. The Orthodox somethimes use the word "valid" (I have done so), for expediency. It is really not a very good word for us since in most cases we are trying to expess those things which are a gift from God and not so much a correct formula. In other words, computer input can be "valid" or "invalid", but a baby is not "validly" born or not "validly" born, if that makes sense to you.

But you are really throwing me off here, and I mean that sincerly. What has to be present for a Latin to hope for "validity" in a Novus Ordo mass (everytime I hear "mass" I think of physics )? Are they doing it wrong, like there is a missing piece or something?

[OrthodoxyOrDeath]

My goodness, I haven't been to that site in awhile, some of that stuff from the link above is just unbelievable. Are we looking at the Ecumenical New-Calendar Church in 20 years here?

[Anastasios]

Please, this is a Novus Ordo service, and therefore it is highly inapropriate to call it a Mass as there is no hope for validity in Novus Ordo Sacraments.

Novus Ordo "catholic" + World "orthodox"= Novus Ordo Saeculorum (New World Order)

Joe Zollars

and...

Joe Zollars + posting on Orthodox forum = disobeying his spiritual father

right, Joe?

[Joe Zollars]

I am not disobeying my spiritual father as he did not share my quasi sedevacantist views (sh. don't tell anyone its a secret ) sort a cut me loose. I am still searching for a sedevacantist priest that is close enough to serve as my confessor (my old one I went to once a month and he was 200 miles away). I may go to the CMRI Bishop that has a chapel up in Plainville.

OOD, what you are seeing at that site is the relatively good stuff. there's a lot worse out there BELIEVE ME. However NOW makes it a very strict point to not publish anything that is not verrified by several sources. BTW, my site was just listed in the archive of NOW yesterday, I'm psyked.

What is necessary for a Mass (would the term "Missa" be better for you? I know I like it better but maybe that's just my opinions that Latin always outranks English) to have grace (to use your terminology) is for it to one, contain the actual canon as approved by the Church and two, if nothing else to have the words "This is My Body...." "This is My Blood, shed for you and for MANY" (Pro Multis not Pro Omnis as the Novus ordites pray).

And there is also a theological position that heretics and those incommunion with heretics loose the ability to form the intention necessary for the confecting of any Sacrament.

However the root problem of the Novus Ordo Sacraments is in the consecration of the Bishop. The new form removes what was previously seen as necessary for the consecration of a Bishop.

It is indeed sad when the Anglican Book of Common Prayer is closer to the real Catholic Mass (The Mass of St. Gregory, the Mass of the Ages, the Mass for which teh Martyrs (of the reformation) died) than is the Novus Ordo service.

Joe Zollars

PS: my former spiritual father also considers feeneyites to be heretics, and therefore I now consider him to be a heretic.

[Seraphim Reeves]

My goodness, I haven't been to that site in awhile, some of that stuff from the link above is just unbelievable. Are we looking at the Ecumenical New-Calendar Church in 20 years here?

I think you're looking at the budding great whore. Though, I think photos from "Assisi" or one of it's many clones would probably give an even clearer image of this.

This is truly the "church" of the anti-Christ - worship whatever you want, so long as you recognize him as a "god" as well. By saying all ways lead to God, one is simply working to destroy THE way to God.

Though the RCC has done much to birth this "whore" (and I wouldn't doubt if the RCC "pontifex maximus" ends up becoming the whore's "pontifex maximus", and the "prophet" who will assist the anti-Christ...though that's only speculation on my part, as far as I know), I think the new-calendarists are ahead in advancing/practicing one of the qualities of the "whore of babylon" described in Scripture - the persecution of the Saints, drinking their blood from gilded chalices (persecution of the Church by the Sergianists, which goes on to this day, and the persecution of the Old Calendarists by the Greek State "church" and the EP).

Seraphim

Seraphim