THE RUSSIAN IS THE SERB’S FRIEND FOREVER?

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sava
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Re: THE RUSSIAN IS THE SERB’S FRIEND FOREVER?

Post by sava »

Despotovac wrote:

Whatever you are now talking about Bishop Akaki, when he came to Serbia was not a one true Orthodox Christian. His effort was all created, and do not forget that the Greek bishops did not give any support for 11 years no one has come to support him, and he from the official Serbian church suffered persecution. Only when he created true orthodox parishes and monasteries then the Greeks remembered Serbia but as its Greek protectorate.

Mr. Despotavac do you have answers for the following questions of Ekklisiastikos?

Ekklisiastikos wrote:

Some are looking for excuses, but there are no excuses for this anticanonic consecration which is a fruit of the slavic chauvinism.

The history of TOC of Greece has nothing to do with the "Serbian matter". These are two different stories. In Greece there was a continuation of True Orthodoxy even after the schism of 1924 . And back in 60's there was an already established and organized Orthodox Church which was left without bishops. And it was at the second panhellenic counsil of TOC clergy and faithful where they elected the candidates and decided to whom to turn for help.

Fr. Akakios or the akakian clique till now has not clarified some issues.

Which Holy Canon of the Orthodox Church allowed Akakios to abandon his lawful Bishop and stop being obedient to Him?
Did his Bishop cease to be orthodox? Did he become a heretic?
Is a bishop's nationality over the Holy canons?
Is an artificial presbyterian autocaphalous concregation of three priests over an orthodox and canonic Holy Synod of Bishops?
Who elected him?
Who anointed him as the only candidate?
Were there any council in Serbia where all the parishes participated and elected him?
Why he was consecrated secretly in France far away from Serbia and ''his flock'' ?
Why the Russians two days after their visit to Archbishop Kallinikos and his objections to the ordianation of HIS priest (fr. Akakios) they proceed to this action? Were they truly looking forward to our union or not ?

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Priest Siluan
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Re: THE RUSSIAN IS THE SERB’S FRIEND FOREVER?

Post by Priest Siluan »

Despotovac wrote:

Bishop Akakije was a novice in a monastery Kovilj in Serbia two years, then for more serious monastic life and problem of ecumenism who practiced in a monastery Kovilj he crossed to Mount Athos. There he settled in Skete Kapsokalivia where as a novice he spent another year with those who mention Bartholomew because they still did not know for zealot fathers. There he met zeilot fathers and decided to break communion with the World Orthodoxy. After breaking communion with the World Orthodoxy, in Mount Athos he became a monk from Serbian heiromonk Raphael and Serbian Hagiorite Monk Daniel. That monastic tonsure was in catacomb conditions of persecution because when Bishop Akakije departure from those who mentioned Bartholomew that meant his illegal stay on Mount Athos. Based on sued of Serbian Monastery Chilandar police asked to kick him out from Mount Athos. Then the Bishop Akakije seriously ill and was forced to move to Athens to Archimandrite Philaret monastery. The day after, in monastic cell, where he lived with a Serbian monk Daniel police arrived with a warrant for the arrest of Bishop Akakije. If he was arrested would be expelled from Greece with the prohibition of return to Greece which would mean termination of the mission of True Orthodoxy in Serbia.

How shameful spectacle is see those who call themselves "True Orthodox" attack a real struggler for true Orthodoxy as Bishop Akakije, who has been persecuted and still is persecuted by the Ecumenist and "Secular" authorities, while these true Orthodox attack and speak from the comfort of Greece or USA, countries with which their own Hierarchy have "links of friendship" with the "secular" Masonic authorities, who are enemies of the Orthodoxy. Their lack of Christian Love has not limits.

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Re: THE RUSSIAN IS THE SERB’S FRIEND FOREVER?

Post by Despotovac »

Reply to Ekklisiastikos:
Some are looking for excuses, but there are no excuses for this anticanonic consecration which is a fruit of the slavic chauvinism.
First and foremost, the history of your synod is full of truly anti-canonical consecrations, and your canonicity is the fruit of the “Slavic chauvinism”of the Russian Church.

The history of TOC of Greece has nothing to do with the "Serbian matter". These are two different stories. In Greece there was a continuation of True Orthodoxy even after the schism of 1924 . And back in 60's there was an already established and organized Orthodox Church which was left without bishops. And it was at the second panhellenic counsil of TOC clergy and faithful where they elected the candidates and decided to whom to turn for help.

Of course, I agree. The official Serbian Church did not bring in the New Calendar, so the apostasy remained unnoticed to the masses. Let’s say, for example, that the New Calendar hadn’t been introduced in Greece. How many people would be True Orthodox? Until the end of the Second World War the Serbian Church was Orthodox and in communion with the Russian Church Abroad. The Communists killed all the zealots for the Orthodox Faith. The Russian Church Abroad, nevertheless, maintained unofficial brotherly relations with the Serbian Church even after the Second World War, while on the other hand Fr. Justin Popovich made a stand for True Orthodoxy but did not stop communion with the Patriarchate, and so a cessation of communion with the Patriarchate was difficult to understand in the sense of its essential importance for one to be Orthodox. Thus the situation in Serbia really cannot be compared with that in Greece. For example, in the sixties and seventies, it was possible for believers from the Serbian Church to commune in churches of the Russian Church Abroad with Old Calendarist Greeks and Russian Catacomb believers. So the “Serbian question” cannot be assessed with the same measurements as the Greek. Thus it is unacceptable that the believers of the official Serbian church who wish to unite with True Orthodoxy be considered as people with no connection to Orthodoxy or the Orthodox Church, and that on this basis they and the canonical territory of the Serbian church be officially declared to fall within the Greek canonical territory.

Fr. Akakios or the akakian clique till now has not clarified some issues.

Which Holy Canon of the Orthodox Church allowed Akakios to abandon his lawful Bishop and stop being obedient to Him?
Did his Bishop cease to be orthodox? Did he become a heretic?
Is a bishop's nationality over the Holy canons?
Is an artificial presbyterian autocaphalous concregation of three priests over an orthodox and canonic Holy Synod of Bishops?

The Greek bishops were accepted by the Serbs as temporary administrative rulers which according to the canons have the right to determine one bishop who would within the period of one year prepare the consecration of a canonical bishop for that widow church. (Seventh Local Council of Constantinople, 74th Canon). If this does not succeed after a period of a year, then the temporary ruler must be changed so that he would not divide the people and in this way assure for himself the appropriation of that jurisdiction. In the Serbian case, the same bishop has already been in charge of Serbia for fifteen years, and over these fifteen years, for eleven of them the bishop did not even visit “his flock”; I think that it is excessive to point out what the holy canons order in this case of the total indifference of the bishop. Due to the activity of this same bishop people have been estranged from each other, and his allegedly temporary rule has lasted indefinitely, and as such, has become formalized, as you say, as “lawful.” Who controls the work of this temporary rule over the widow Serbian Church, and to whom can the believers of the Serbian Church complain in this difficult and uncanonical situation? Requests for the change of the bishop in question have been sent to the Synod, but of course the Synod has always been on his side throughout the years. Until the appearance of a Russian TOC, the Serbians were in an inescapable situation of Greek violence towards Her weak and powerless sister, the widow Serbian Church.

Who elected him?
Who anointed him as the only candidate?
Were there any council in Serbia where all the parishes participated and elected him?
Why he was consecrated secretly in France far away from Serbia and ''his flock'' ?
Why the Russians two days after their visit to Archbishop Kallinikos and his objections to the ordianation of HIS priest (fr. Akakios) they proceed to this action? Were they truly looking forward to our union or not ?

Because in Serbia thanks to the Greek bishop divisions were created between believers, splitting those who are for and against Bishop Akakije, in any case he was the first candidate for the episcopacy from the beginning and the founder of True Orthodoxy in Serbia. The Kallinikos group in Serbia considers itself as the Greek Church and Greek believers and because of that this matter was not discussed with them, because it is a question of a Serbian bishop for the Serbian Church. All of those who take the position that they are the True Orthodox clergy and believers of the Serbian Church and that their parishes and monasteries are Serbian, along with the entire jurisdiction of the Serbian Church, were of one mind that the only candidate was the present Bishop Akakije. Concerning France, we in Serbia do not have a church of a normal size and altar where three bishops and clergy could consecrate a bishop (which Brother Sava knows well as he has visited all of our churches).

ПРАВОСЛАВЉЕ ИЛИ СМРТ!

sava
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Re: THE RUSSIAN IS THE SERB’S FRIEND FOREVER?

Post by sava »

Dear fr. Siluan as you have already written in this forum, ''God and time will tell who are truly Bp. Akakije and his people. " by their fruits ye shall know them".

You write ''...Greece or USA, countries with which their own Hierarchy have "links of friendship" with the "secular" Masonic authorities...''. What do you mean? Who is this Hierarchy?

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Re: THE RUSSIAN IS THE SERB’S FRIEND FOREVER?

Post by Priest Siluan »

sava wrote:

You write ''...Greece or USA, countries with which their own Hierarchy have "links of friendship" with the "secular" Masonic authorities...''. What do you mean? Who is this Hierarchy?

I think everybody here knows about what I meant.

sava
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Re: THE RUSSIAN IS THE SERB’S FRIEND FOREVER?

Post by sava »

Priest Siluan wrote:
sava wrote:

You write ''...Greece or USA, countries with which their own Hierarchy have "links of friendship" with the "secular" Masonic authorities...''. What do you mean? Who is this Hierarchy?

I think everybody here knows about what I meant.

Is it so difficult for you fr. Siluan to make clear what you mean?

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Re: THE RUSSIAN IS THE SERB’S FRIEND FOREVER?

Post by Despotovac »

In my reply to Eklisiastikos has an error. Instead of Seventh Local Council in Constantinople should be written: Eight local Council in Cartagena. Sorry. :(

There is a difference in the numbering in different editions of Pidalion - Nomocanon: Serbian edition (Saint Sava) - 75th canon, Serbian etition (Bishop Nikodim Milash) - 74th canon and Greek eedition (Ralli & Potli, Sintagma) - 74th canon.

In the Greek edition of the V. Rigopulu that canon is omitted - do not exist! :?

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