Moderator: Mark Templet
Can anybody tell why is it true that what the west refers to Augustine as Saint, Orthodoxy refers him as "blessed" is title
based on the fact that his confession differs from the Doctors? please explain, can "blessed" be
given to people like John Maximovitch of Shanghai and Father Seraphim Rose? And why isn't St John Maximovith considered
a saint by Matthewites? Jeff C.
So the healing and prophetic powers of John of Shanghai where they of a diabolical nature like that of Muhammeds visions?
Even John of Shanghai's miracles were mostly beneficial to ROCOR congregants and outside people alike, can you explain his
wonderworking powers? are they not much different also than that of western "Saints"--Francis Assisi, Francis Xavier,
Dominic, Joan of Arc, and the list goes on. Jeff C.
"So the healing and prophetic powers of John of Shanghai where they of a diabolical nature like that of Muhammeds visions?John of Shanghai's miracles were mostly beneficial to ROCOR congregants and outside people alike, can you explain his wonderworking powers? are they not much different also than that of western "Saints"--Francis Assisi, Francis Xavier, Dominic, Joan of Arc, and the list goes on." Jeff C.
You are in trouble Jeff when you equate heretics and even a forerunner of antichrist (Mohammad) to Saint John the Wonderworker.
Is there a need for comparison?
St. John preached the Word of God in multiple nations and Francis preached to birds. Another, St. John never condoned violence and Joan who led an entire army to slaughter.
Pray and search out an honest Orthodox Priest/Elder to help you.
Peace.
The Matthewites separated from the other Old Calendarists very early, with only a brief period in the 70s when they were in communion with both ROCA and (I think) Auxentius' synod. So they haven't recognized the canonizations performed by ROCA since then, including St John Maximovich.
I don't totally understand your objections to St John. Since he was a ROCA bishop, it makes sense that most of his miracles would be performed among the faithful of that church. Yes, signs and wonders can be performed outside the Church, but in that case you can discern whether the signs are of good or bad origin by the character of the one performing them: is he Orthodox, does he live a godly life? It seems to me St John fulfilled both criteria.
Regarding this:
ioannis_theologos wrote:The Matthewites separated from the other Old Calendarists very early, with only a brief period in the 70s when they were in communion with both ROCA and (I think) Auxentius' synod.
If you are willing to deny that the State Church of Greece fell into schism in 1924, then I suppose it is understandable that you would not consider the Genuine Orthodox Christians, the "Matthewites", to be the true continuation of the Orthodox Church in Greece.
But then, this discussion already has its own designated area.
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Priest Mark Smith
British Columbia
Then again Byzantine Roman emperors were known as "Vice Regeants of God" so were the Russian Czars by extension like a prime minister or chancellor under or beside Christ. They carried the tradition, office, and pomp of the Roman Empire until the fall in 1453AD. Eusebius of Caesarea refered to St Constantine the Great as a bishop simply because he protected Orthodox Bishops and allowed true confessing Bishops to profess their faith pubically without persecution--a very good friend of the Church--they all lead armies, committed atrocities, and did questionable things like both the Muslims and Latins did. Basil II the Bulgar Slayer blinded 15,000 captured prisoners of war and Czar Nicholas II did the December massacre of pro-soviets with or without his knowledge. Jeff C.
Jeff,
Your arguments stray outside Orthodoxy which is the "only" medium for discussing signs of sanctfication and living holy. Swimming in a "sea of confusion" is not a good place to be. This is the reason why you should pray and search out an honest priest/elder to help you out.
Peace.
