6th Sunday After Pentecost - July 14/27

Reading from the Old Testament, Holy Gospels, Acts, Epistles and Revelation, our priests' and bishops' sermons, and commentary by the Church Fathers. All Forum Rules apply.


OrthodoxyOrDeath

6th Sunday After Pentecost - July 14/27

Post by OrthodoxyOrDeath »

For this coming Sunday....(Greek calendar is all I know :) )

-The Holy Fathers of the Fourth Ecumenical Synod
-St. Nicodemos of the Holy Mountain
-Saint Aquila of the Seventy
-St. Joseph, Archbishop of Thessaloniki

In the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit.

Evangelistarion
Matthew 9:1-8

"And He embarked into the ship, and went across, and came into His own city. And behold, they were bringing to Him a paralytic, who was laid on a couch. And Jesus, having seen their faith, said to the paralytic, 'Be of good courage, child; they sins have been forgiven thee.' And behold, certain of the Scibes said within themselves, 'This One blasphemeth.' And Jesus having perceived their thoughts, said, "Why are ye thinking evil in your hearts? For which is easier to say, 'The sins have been forgiven thee', or to say 'Arise and be walking?' But that ye may know that the Son of Man hath authority on the Earth to forgive sins" - then saith He to the paralytic, "Arise and take up they couch, and go to thine house." And he rose and went away to His house. And after the crowds saw it, they marvelled and glorified God, Who gave such authority to men."

John 17:1-13
These words spoke Jesus, and lifted up His eyes to the heaven, and said, "Father, the hour hath come. Glorify they Son, that thy Son might glorify Thee, even as thou gavest Him authority over all flesh, in order that all whom thou hast given Him, He should give to them life eternal. And this is the eternal life, that they may be knowing Thee, the only true God, and Jesus Christ Whom Thou didst send forth. I glorified Thee on the earth. I finished the work which Thou hast given Me that I should do. And now, O Father, glorify Thou Me with Thyself, with the glory which I had with Thee before the world came to be. I manifested Thy name to the men whom Thou hast given me out of the world. Thine they were, adn Thou hast given them to Me, and they have kept Thy word. Now they have come to know that all things whatsoever Thou hast given Me are from Thee. For the words which Thou hast given to Me, I have given to them; and they received them, and know truly that I came forth from Thee; and they believed that Thou dist send Me forth. I make request concerning them. I do not make request concerning the world, but concerning these whom Thou hast given to Me, for they are Thine; and all My things are Thine, and Thy things are Mine, and I have been glorified in them. And I am no longer in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to Thee. Holy Father, keep in Thy name those that Thou hast given Me, in order that they may be one, even as We. When I was with them in the world I was keeping them in thy name. Those whom Thou hast given me I have guarded, and none of them parished, except the son of perdition that the Scripture might be fulfilled. And now I come to Thee, and these things I speak in the world, that they may be having My joy made full in them.

Amen.

Note: I have hand typed the above from the "The Orthodox New Testament" - Dormition Skete. I have been very careful and have proofread the text. But if someone finds a typo, please point it out.

EDIT: I made the changes Paradosis, thank you for pointing them out. I also unbolded the text since I think it is easy to read unbolded.

Last edited by OrthodoxyOrDeath on Wed 23 July 2003 2:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 6th Sunday After Pentecost - July 14/27

Post by 尼古拉前执事 »

OrthodoxyOrDeath wrote:

Note: I have hand typed the above from the "The Orthodox New Testament" - Dormition Skete. I have been very careful and have proofread the text. But if someone finds a typo, please point it out.

Good choice in Bibles. :D I have not seen any typos.
Should I take this as you volunteering to post the verses every week?

Justin Kissel

Post by Justin Kissel »

Normally I wouldn't point stuff out like this, but since you asked about typos... :) ...from the last part...

"And I ma no longer in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to Thee. Holy Father, keep in Thy name those that Thou hast given Me, in order that they may be one, even as We. When I was with them in the world I was keeping them in thy name. Those whom Thou hast given me I have gaurded, and none of them parished, except the sone of perdition that the Scripture might be fulfilled. And now I come to Thee, and these things I speak in the world, that they may be having My joy made full in them."

Justin Kissel

Post by Justin Kissel »

A few notes before I post the quotes this week. First, it is not thought that listing a bunch of patristic quotes together and trying to "mesh them together" will necessarily bring you to the truth. Tradition is a living thing, not a bunch of quotes strung together. There is always a danger/temptation to treat the Fathers in the same way that some groups treat the Scriptures, which might or might not lead us to the truth, but would almost certainly be a wrong way to approach things. The Fathers inform us, they help us interpret Scripture--they are indeed, collectively, the infallible interpreter, the mind of the Church--but we shouldn't try to string passages from the Father's together just to support our own notions and interpretations.

The second thing is that these lists of patristic quotes will sometimes be very long. I know this can be intimidating to some, so all I want to say is, please don't let this keep you from posting on these threads! You can go through a couple (perhaps the ones other people seem to be focusing on), you could read just two or three a day, or perhaps approach things in some other way. Anyway, here's the patristic resources I found that might be helpful in understanding Jn. 17:1-13:


Saint Augustine, Tractates on: (Jn. 17:1-5) (Jn. 17:6-8) (Jn. 17:9-13).

Saint John Chrysostom, Homilies on: (Jn. 17:1-5) (Jn. 17:6-13)

Saint Hilary of Poitiers, On the Trinity, 3, 13-14

"Nevertheless, I have heard of some who have passed in among you, holding the wicked doctrine of the strange and evil spirit; to whom ye did not allow entrance to sow their tares, but stopped your ears that ye might not receive that error which was proclaimed by them, as being persuaded that that spirit which deceives the people does not speak the things of Christ, but his own, for he is a lying spirit. But the Holy Spirit does not speak His own things, but those of Christ, and that not from himself, but from the Lord; even as the Lord also announced to us the things that He received from the Father. For... He says of Himself to the Father, 'I have,' says He, 'glorified Thee upon the earth ; I have finished the work which, Thou gavest Me; I have manifested Thy name to men.'"(Jn. 17: 4-6) - Saint Ignatius, Epistle to the Ephesians, 9

"In the beginning, therefore, did God form Adam, not as if He stood in need of man, but that He might have [some one] upon whom to confer His benefits. For not alone antecedently to Adam, but also before all creation, the Word glorified His Father, remaining in Him; and was Himself glorified by the Father, as He did Himself declare, 'Father, glorify Thou Me with the glory which I had with Thee before the world was.' (Jn. 17:5)" - Saint Irenaeus, Against Heresies, 4, 14, 1

"For when the Word of God, our Lord Jesus Christ, came unto all, and gathering alike the learned and unlearned, published to every sex and every age the precepts of salvation He made a large compendium of His precepts, that the memory of the scholars might not be burdened in the celestial learning, but might quickly learn what was necessary to a simple faith. Thus, when He taught what is life eternal, He embraced the sacrament of life in a large and divine brevity, saying, 'And this is life eternal, that they might know Thee, the only and true God, and Jesus Christ, whom Thou hast sent.' (Jn. 17:3)" - Saint Cyprian, On the Lords Prayer, 28

"Look, therefore, while there is time, to the true and eternal salvation; and since now the end of the world is at hand, turn your minds to God, in the fear of God; nor let that powerless and vain dominion in the world over the just and meek delight you, since in the field, even among the cultivated and fruitful corn, the tares and the darnel have dominion. Nor say ye that ill fortunes happen because your gods are not worshipped by us; but know that this is the judgment of God's anger, that He who is not acknowledged on account of His benefits may at least be acknowledged through His judgments. Seek the Lord even late; for long ago, God, forewarning by His prophet, exhorts and says, 'Seek ye the Lord, and your soul shall live.' (Amos 5:6) Know God even late; for Christ at His coming admonishes and teaches this, saying, 'This is life eternal, that they might know Thee, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom Thou hast sent.' (Jn. 17:3)" - Saint Cyprian, An Address to Demetrianus, 23

"For whereas in the Gospels, and in the epistles of the apostles, the name of Christ is alleged for the remission of sins; it is not in such a way as that the Son alone, without the Father, or against the Father, can be of advantage to anybody; but that it might be shown to the Jews, who boasted as to their having the Father, that the Father would profit them nothing, unless they believed on the Son whom He had sent. For they who know God the Father the Creator, ought also to know Christ the Son, lest they should flatter and applaud themselves about the Father alone, without the acknowledgment of His Son, who also said, 'No man cometh to the Father but by me.' (Jn. 14:6) But He, the same, sets forth, that it is the knowledge of the two which saves, when He says, "And this is life eternal, that they might know Thee, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.' (Jn. 17:3) Since, therefore, from the preaching and testimony of Christ Himself, the Father who sent must be first known, then afterwards Christ, who was sent, and there cannot be a hope of salvation except by knowing the two together; how, when God the Father is not known, nay, is even blasphemed, can they who among the heretics are said to be baptized in the name of Christ, be judged to have obtained the remission of sins?" - Saint Cyprian, Epistle 72, 17

"The name of 'God the Father' had been published to none. Even Moses, who had interrogated Him on that very point, had heard a different name. (Ex. 3:13-16) To us it has been revealed in the Son, for the Son is now the Father's new name. 'I am come,' saith He, 'in the Father's name;' (Jn. 5:43) and again, 'Father, glorify Thy name;' (Jn. 12:28 ) and more openly, 'I have manifested Thy name to men.' (Jn. 17:6)" - Tertullian, On Prayer, 3

"They more readily supposed that the Father acted in the Son's name, than that the Son acted in the Father's; although the Lord says Himself, 'I am come in my Father's name;' (Jn. 5:43) and even to the Father He declares, 'I have manifested Thy name unto these men;' (Jn. 17:6) whilst the Scripture likewise says, 'Blessed is He that cometh in the name of the Lord,' (Ps. 118:26) that is to say, the Son in the Father's name. And as for the Father's names, God Almighty, the Most High, the Lord of hosts, the King of Israel, the 'One that is,' we say (for so much do the Scriptures teach us) that they belonged suitably to the Son also, and that the Son came under these designations, and has always acted in them, and has thus manifested them in Himself to men. 'All things,' says He, 'which the Father hath are mine.' (Jn. 16:15)" - Tertullian, Against Praxeas, 17

"These Three are, one essence, not one Person, as it is said, 'I and my Father are One,' (Jn. 10:30) in respect of unity of substance not singularity of number. Run through the whole Gospel, and you will find that He whom you believe to be the Father (described as acting for the Father, although you, for your part, forsooth, suppose that 'the Father, being the husbandman,' (Jn. 15:1) must surely have been on earth) is once more recognised by the Son as in heaven, when, 'lifting up His eyes thereto,' (Jn. 17:1) He commended His disciples to the safe-keeping of the Father. (Jn. 17:11)" - Tertullian, Against Praxeas, 25

"For who else was 'He which is to come' than Christ? And as no one ought to be offended, seeing God is the Father, that the Saviour is also God; so also, since the Father is called omnipotent, no one ought to be offended that the Son of God is also cared omnipotent. For in this way will that saying be true which He utters to the Father, 'All Mine are Thine, and Thine are Mine, and I am glorified in them.' (Jn. 17:10)" - the heretic Origen, First Principles, 1, 2, 10

OrthodoxyOrDeath

Post by OrthodoxyOrDeath »

Justin,

Thank you very much for finding those texts, I just finished reading them. Unfortunatley, I don't have the time I hoped for this week to explore this thread more like I intended.

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Post by Jakub »

Very good indeed, it would have taken me a couple of hours, not including proof reading.

The choice of text and source also.

Thank you both,
james

Justin Kissel

Post by Justin Kissel »

Saint Cyprian's comment has a very deep meaning, I think... a far reaching meaning. He says in his On the Lords Prayer that Jesus essentially summed up salvation very simply: and I think this is very important for a wide range of reasons (epistemology, salvation, ecclesiology, etc). Saint Cyprian is here showing that Jesus asks us to start simple, and work our way up. To seek that which we can as spiritual infants, after which all the other stuff that is necessary will be added to us. But not added based on how much we think we can handle, but based on God's timing and discernment, which is perfect. Jesus chose to give a simple summation, and it is Christ our God that will decide if and when we are ready for more.

And how are we all "one" as the passage speaks of? Not through everyone figuring it out intellectually and then issuing a statement that we agree! But by confessing and taking to heart the same, simple truth; after which God teaches us each more and more according to our capacity to learn and believe and use... and there is no division: the Holy Spirit teaches only what Christ teaches, who teaches only what the Father teaches. And so, we are one because we are all taught the same: the same faith, the same love, the same thrice-brilliant undivided and uncorrupted and unoriginate truth. Not only was it beautiful and profound in a superficial way, but he was speaking divine words of truth and meaning when Saint Cyprian said:

"For when the Word of God, our Lord Jesus Christ, came unto all, and gathering alike the learned and unlearned, published to every sex and every age the precepts of salvation He made a large compendium of His precepts, that the memory of the scholars might not be burdened in the celestial learning, but might quickly learn what was necessary to a simple faith. Thus, when He taught what is life eternal, He embraced the sacrament of life in a large and divine brevity, saying, 'And this is life eternal, that they might know Thee, the only and true God, and Jesus Christ, whom Thou hast sent.' (Jn. 17:3)" - Saint Cyprian, On the Lords Prayer, 28

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