Evolution and an Orthodox Patristic understanding of Genesis

[ChristosVoskrese]

Read http://www.answersingenesis.org/creatio ... darwin.asp to see what Darwin's real message was.

And about Darwin's supposed "renunciation of evolution" on his deathbed, Charles's daughter Henrietta (Litchfield) wrote on page 12 of the London evangelical weekly, The Christian, for 23 February 1922, 'I was present at his deathbed. Lady Hope [the lady whom Darwin supposedly renounced evolution to] was not present during his last illness, or any illness. I believe he never even saw her, but in any case she had no influence over him in any department of thought or belief. He never recanted any of his scientific views, either then or earlier … . The whole story has no foundation whatever'.
Some have even concluded that there was no Lady Hope.

Arrogance is not a proper Orthodox attitude in my opinion. The whole "follow me or you will go to hell" thing is very protestant. The Orthodox startsi will all say that God is free to save whomever he wishes, whether that person believes the earth is 15 billion years old, 6 days old, whether he/she believes in Krishna or Buddha or worships the tree in front of his/her house.

Btw, Buddhists don't worship Buddha.

The True Orthodox teaching has always been "Outside the [Orthodox] Church there is no salvation". True, God is free to save whoever he wishes, but to say that people who worship Krishna or Shiva will be saved by worshipping Krishna or Shiva is a direct denial of the First Commandment. Psalm 95:5 states "All the gods of the Gentiles are devils".

There is no conflict between science and religion. Evolution is not science. It is an unproven hypothesis, accepted as "science" because it doesn't require belief in a supernatural Creator.

[stumbler]

If it is true that outside the Orthodox faith there is no salvation, as you say, then it is indeed not possible for God to save whomever He wishes.

God is all powerful.

You might want to rethink your interpretation of your words.

Most Orthodox thinkers will tell you that Orthodoxy is the only sure path to salvation, which is entirely different from what you have posited.

I appreciate that you bolster my point that this is essentially a Protestant issue by quoting an "evangelical" publication.

[joasia]

Pravoslavnik,

Do I have to actually observe the Colorado River carving out the sedimentary layers of the Grand Canyon over a period of millions of years in order to assert that the Canyon was, in fact, carved by the Colorado River?

And what exactly is the evolutionist "scientific" explanation of the formation of the Grand Canyon? Answer that and then I will show you that their "theory" is not logical, based on the laws of water erosion.

Do I have to actually have observed the activities and deaths of Wolly Mammoths in Colorado during the last Ice Age in order to assert that the Wolly Mammoths did, in fact, once live in Colorado?

No. But, that just proves that they died. It doesn't prove that they evolved from a pool of goo.

Can I not rely on geological and fossil evidence as facts about paleology

Geologists date the geological columns by the fossils they find in them...the paleontologist date the fossils by the geological column they are found in. How can this be valid science? They contradict each other.

Can you tell us if you have read The Origin of Species or The Voyage of the Beagle?

No. But, Darwin's "theories" have been taught in the schools since my lifetime so I have been exposed to them. What points do you want to expound on. Be specific. Don't make vague remarks.

Joanna has further stated that Orthodoxy does not give us an "aspect" of the truth, but the whole truth

So you think Orthodoxy is not the full truth of God's teachings? I just disagreed with your choice of words towards Orthodoxy as being an "aspect". Science is God's way of allowing mankind discover how intricate the world and space He created.

St. John the Baptist, Jesus Christ, and the Holy Apostles preached the truth to the people. Was it necessary for them or the holy fathers to give an exertation on the science of oxygen?

Science was always around, but the purpose of Christ, the Holy Apostles and the holy fathers was to bring souls to salvation.

You have yet to give solid scientific proof of evolution.

[joasia]

Angela,

That's really cute!! Too funny!

Also, the Orthodox Big Bang Theory: God spoke and bang it happened!!!

God spoke and BANG!, it happened. :mrgreen:

In Christ, Joanna

[ANGELA]

Joanna,

I thought you would like that, also well said in defense of our Orthodox faith!

In Christ
Angela+++

[joasia]

Pravoslavnik,

At what point in time did God create the soul, during this alleged process of evolution?

Here's two quotes from St. Basil the Great about evolution of species.

Let us see now what St. Basil believed about the "evolution" or "fixity" of species. He writes:

There is nothing truer than this, that each plant either has seed or there exists in it some generative power. And this accounts for the expression "of its own kind." For the shoot of the reed is not productive of an olive tree, but from the reed comes another reed; and from seeds spring plants related to the seeds sown. Thus, what was put forth by the earth in its first generation has been preserved until the present time, since the species persisted through constant reproduction. (Hexaemeron, V,2.)

Again, St. Basil writes:

The nature of existing objects, set in motion by one command, passes through creation without change, by generation and destruction, preserving the succession of the species through resemblance until it reaches the very end. It begets a horse as the successor of a horse, a lion of a lion, and an eagle of an eagle; and it continues to preserve each of the animals by uninterrupted successions until the consummation of the universe. No length of time causes the specific characteristics of the animals to be corrupted or extinct, but, as if established just recently, nature, ever fresh, moves along with time. (Hexaemeron, IX, 2.)

[Cyprian]

O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called: Which some professing have erred concerning the faith. Grace be with thee. Amen. (1 Timothy 6:20-21)