Archbishop Of Canterbury Has Only Met God In RO CHURCH

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Kollyvas
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Wny Did The Archbishop Of Canterbury Not Become Fr. Roman?

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Why did the Archbishop of Canterbury not become Fr Roman?

The Times of London of Saturday 12 November carries an interesting article about the Archbishop of Canterbury, Dr Rowan Williams, entitled: ‘Archbishop reveals his unorthodox way to God’. Although written by the Times Religion Correspondent, Ruth Gledhill, it contains the usual journalistic nonsense about the Church of England going back to before the Synod of Whitby in 664 (!), states that the Orthodox Churches go back to the ‘Byzantine’ (sic) Empire, which ‘are in schism with Rome’ (!), that in the Orthodox Church we have ‘weekly masses’ (!), that these last for ‘three hours’ (!), and also implies that we honour the Patriarch of Constantinople as our Pope! Unfortunately, in the new dumbed-down world of the tabloid Times, anything goes. (We cannot forget that the Blair-supporting Australian owner of The Times also publishes the well-known adult comic The Sun).

Nevertheless, the article does reveal that the Anglican Archbishop’s first encounter with God was at a liturgy of the Russian Orthodox Church, when he was aged 14. Here he met the ‘living God’ and when he left he felt that he ‘had seen glory and praise for the first time’. ‘I felt I had seen and heard people who were behaving as if God were real. I came away with the sense of absolute objectivity and majesty and beauty of God which I have never forgotten. If people worshipped like this, I felt God must be a great deal more real (than) I have ever learnt him so far’.

The question that arises is why the teenage boy, like many before and since, did not join the Orthodox Church? In order to answer this, let us imagine for a moment that he had done so. What would his future have been?

First of all, he would probably have had to wait to join the Orthodox Church until he was eighteen years old - unless of course his parents had given him permission to join the Church as a minor and the receiving Orthodox priest had agreed to receive him at such a young age. Secondly, he would have had to take the name of a saint, rather than that of a tree. For the sake of argument, perhaps the name ‘Roman’, sufficiently similar to his first name, would have done.

With his academic bent, the young Roman would have gone to University and perhaps studied theology. He would not have studied in the theoretical way he did study, but, as an Orthodox, he would have lived theology. Given his inclinations, he would have gone on to do a doctoral thesis, perhaps on a Church Father, either ancient or perhaps contemporary. He would have made pilgrimages to Orthodox lands and monasteries. He would have learnt not only Patristic Greek, but also perhaps Russian. Had he wanted to serve not only as an academic, but also as a priest, he would have married an Orthodox. Given his religious inclinations, he would eventually have become a priest - Fr Roman Williams.

So far we can see several parallels between his real life and his imaginary life. But at this point all parallels stop. Firstly, as a married Orthodox man, he would never have become a bishop. Secondly, as a non-Russian and non-Greek (and non-Serb and non-Romanian), he would have been treated as a second-class citizen by whatever jurisdiction he belonged to. Without the right ethnic surname and background, he would have ended up as an unpaid priest in a small parish, living off the fruits of his secular labours, struggling by himself to fund the purchase of a family home, and the establishment of a small parish church, juggling to balance priestly, professional and family life. After thirty or forty years hard labour, he might have received some small token of appreciation, which, had he had an ethnic surname, he would have received after thirty or forty months.

It now becomes very clear why Dr Rowan Williams did not become Fr Roman Williams. His mind told him, consciously or unconsciously, that he would be a fool to renounce a paid career, a free house and episcopal promotion in the Anglican Church for continual suffering in the Orthodox Church.

Such indeed are the reasons why thousands of Western people have not joined the Orthodox Church. The Orthodox Church is the bearing of the Cross. As so many people say to me: ‘It is too hard’. Unfortunately, the Western mentality is such that, although its heart may be touched by Orthodox Christianity, its rationalistic mind calculates that Orthodox Christianity is not for it. As the Russian saying and the writer, Griboyedov, say: ‘Grief comes from the mind’ (‘Gore ot uma’). The greatest barrier to the Conversion of the West is this very problem. Many in the West have a believing heart, but, after a thousand years of cultural deformation, the Western mind, more often unconsciously than consciously, is profoundly atheistic and calculating. When the future Archbishop saw in Orthodoxy ‘the living God’, saw and heard ‘people who were behaving as if God were real’, he saw true. But his mind could not, and did not, accept the true sacrifice that Orthodoxy involves.

When I met the doctoral student Rowan Williams in Oxford in late 1976 or early 1977 and had a conversation with him about St Gregory Palamas, I met an interesting man. His heart was surely in the right place, but unfortunately his mind already seemed to have been distorted by the intellectual and cultural prejudice of Western academia. Since then it has been disfigured further by studying political correctness à la Guardian, which has led him into all manner of doctrinal incorrectness, and indeed actual heresy. And the problem with heresy, the result of spiritual impurity, is that it blinds the mind to the truth and then infects the heart, blinding it too.

Above, I have listed several advantages that Dr Williams has enjoyed in not joining the Orthodox Church. However, in not making the sacrifice, Dr Williams has also missed so much. His mind has not conformed to the faith of his heart; he has not known the quickness of the Spirit; compromise has followed on compromise. Since I have very strong doubts about my own eternal salvation, I would not at all wish to make any judgment about the eternal salvation of anyone else. But I can say this much; that in the bearing of the Orthodox Cross, we see the light of the Orthodox Resurrection. And that is unknown outside the Orthodox Church. And for that grace alone, I have no hesitation in saying that I regret the choice of our lost Fr Roman Williams.

Fr Andrew

31 October/13 November 2005
The Holy Apostle Aristobulus, Bishop of Britain

Ebor
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and again the other is ignored

Post by Ebor »

Once again, an EO writer conveniently ignores the second experiece that the young Rowan Williams had with meeting God: at a Baptist service. I wonder if there will be any Baptists writing about how bad it is that the now Archbishop missed his chance to be a Baptist Preacher and represent the Truth as they see it.

And once again, the article is posted in its entirety. I wonder if it's copyrighted, like so many that have been thrown here.

Ebor

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Kollyvas
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Sources...

Post by Kollyvas »

That you lack sources or even address content is telling. Most of what you maintain is copyrighted comes off news wires whose expressed purpose is PUBLIC DISSEMINATION or is quoted partially or is public domain: moreover your allies have quoted journals LIKE COMMONWEAL, without a link. IN ENTIRETY... Only certain types of information or people merit protest it seems. Secondly, the prelate in question NEVER mentions this experince IN HIS OWN COMMUNION. Lastly, we have put forward the utter error of anglicanism--silence is a quiet concession that Orthodoxy is the Truth; rejection of it therefore becomes an argument for/methodology of the "church" of judas iscariot...
r
Vincentian Canon?!

Ebor
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Re: Substantiation buried the obfuscation...

Post by Ebor »

Kollyvas wrote:

My points have been grounded in sourced information--make THEM retract the Truth if you can.

The writers of the articles that you have broadcast (and I'm sorry, but I doubt that you have read all of them yourself) are not here. If you cannot state ideas in your own words, what understanding you actually have of anything Anglican beyond what you might see in the popular press, which does not show the masses of Faithful Christians in the Communion. That wouldn't make for good headlines.

With the ease with which you toss around aspersions like "pontius pilate" and relativist and all the rest, I hope that if you should meet an Anglican in real life that you are able to control the invective. If not, what kind of disciple of Jesus would one be to treat another human being so?

Modern betrayal with a kiss or with a smirk?!

Or with a club of abuse heaped on anyone who doesn't agree?

"Behold, how they love one another."

Ebor

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Kollyvas
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Abuse...

Post by Kollyvas »

Christ expelled the money changers and NEVER compromised Truth--He even questioned, "What part hath God with belial?" I've more than grounded my position as it seems you quietly avoid it. The terms I use fit ever so painfully. I've met plenty of Anglicans--the sincere ones just keep on becoming Orthodox... And it's a matter of hating sin (lies) not the sinner (the heretic)...That's true love according to St. Paul.
r

Ebor
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Re: Sources...

Post by Ebor »

Kollyvas wrote:

That you lack sources or even address content is telling. Most of what you maintain is copyrighted comes off news wires whose expressed purpose is PUBLIC DISSEMINATION or is quoted partially or is public domain: moreover your allies have quoted journals LIKE COMMONWEAL, without a link. IN ENTIRETY...

My allies? "Commonweal"? :roll:

Secondly, the prelate in question NEVER mentions this experince IN HIS OWN COMMUNION.

In that one article that you erroneously interpreted in favour of the EO.
An Arguement from silence.

Lastly, we have put forward the utter error of anglicanism--silence is a quiet concession that Orthodoxy is the Truth; rejection of it therefore becomes an argument for/methodology of the "church" of judas iscariot...

"We"? Is there more then one of you using the "Kollyvas" account? that might explain the vast dump of articles every day, as there seems to be more then any one person could read and do other things in life.

There has not been "silence" here. There have been postings. This is an EO board (or it used to be) There has been discussion on Anglicanism as regarding the starting article that you did not represent truthfully. If your abuse of other Human Beings, and misrepresentation of what others have said is an example of your Truth, How is that following Jesus, who is the source of all Truth?

Ebor

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posts...

Post by Kollyvas »

First I have too many posts, then none at all--which is it?! It seems we've touched on 39 Articles, Vincentian Canon, Rowan Williams--all met by silence, save potshots aimed at me personally. Is that the strength of Anglican apologetics?! Secondly, I have yet to get personal in discussing this topic, and the charity offered is exposing error and proclaiming the Truth of the Father, Son, Holy Spirit even to Anglicans...ORTHODOXY IS THE ONE TRUE CHURCH FOR ALL!
r

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