Justin Kissel wrote:
- A year ago ROAC-V in America was celebrating how great their Church was, how fast it was growing, and how Gregory of CO would soon be nothing but a footnote in history. Well, it's one year later, and with the recent switch of 2 GOC clergymen, ole Gregory of CO might just have more priests than ROAC-V in America. I'm sure by next year there will have been enough jurisdiction-hopping to get ROAC-V (or some other ROAC faction) back on top though.
First off, there is no other "ROAC". Gregory of Colorado hasn't a single parish in Russia so he can't call himself the Russian Orthodox Autonomous Church. There is no other "ROAC faction"-- the Mass fathers decided to commemorate no one. They have no place to go, so they are nothing but suspended priests, jurisdictionally.
You are also not noting the fact that two of our priests have reposed in the Lord.
Justin Kissel wrote:
- ROAC-V accepted some interesting characters with a colorful history into their fold. I'm trying to be nice (though I do admit to chuckling at Hatala's sarcastic snipe). Ok, ok, maybe this is a Russian thing or something, because ROCOR has the EXACT same problem. One thing ROCOR doesn't do though is give them so much authority, though I guess when you have a half dozen priests and half are new, you don't have much choice. Now, of course, that the Fathers have apparently left, the people who were formerly praising them are making comments about how they have been through so many jurisdictions. Um, yeah, that didn't seem to be a big issue a couple months ago when y'all in ROAC-V thought they were on your side.
That's not true. I have not supported Fr Spyridon Schneider's accession since last year when I left Ipswich. And that's a fact. Starting the news website, NFTU, got me kicked out of Ipswich, for example. By January of this year, we had already known something like this was going to happen and began to take steps to correct it.
Justin Kissel wrote:
- You are STILL having problems with resolving the Gregory L situation?
No. It's been resolved.
Justin Kissel wrote:
- In real life, Valentine and Paul of Astoria don't seem that far apart ecclesiologically and otherwise... in real life anyway, and in secret. Of course, I only know that by reading between the lines, personal emails, etc. Of course, they can't say what they really want to say openly because of the hard-liners in their jurisdictions (almost all of whom find their way onto the itnernet), so they say what they think adequate to cover the whole "we hate ecumenism, world Orthodoxy is bad" scheme, and the internet Christians pass the info right along.
I think that perhaps its not so much that we have a secret ecclesiology, so much as it is that the "hard-liners" are constantly misinterpreted. Both Metropolitan Valentine and Pavlos of Astoria hate ecumenism and are against union with official Orthodoxy. Openly and privately. It's been offered to them. They don't want it. What they won't do is tell babushkas that they are going to hell because of the "saving grace coming out of their hands", like the cult leaders.
Justin Kissel wrote:
- When people leave one of the ROAC factions, they almost inevitably flee to a jurisdiction that has had half a dozen schism in the last century. They may be alone and feel betrayed four times over, but hey, they're still right and the other 99.9% of Orthodox in America are wrong.
Actually, the only people I know who have managed to get to a jurisdiction have gone to either ROCOR, the GOC, or the MP. Most of the recent people who have fled have not joined a jurisdiction at all.
Chaos is nothing new in the jurisdictional history of Orthodoxy, especially in America. What I am glad for is that this has produced a real unity of mindset we didn't see before between those of us who stayed.
