Why this new section and forum?

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尼古拉前执事
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Post by 尼古拉前执事 »

George Australia wrote:

The Pope is certainly not currently on the Dyptych of Constantinople- whose Dyptich is he on?

When I get home, if I have the time, I will try to find the thread where the Vatican and either EP Meletius or EP Athenagoras said otherwise.

As for the back door communion, it remins unclear when the Serbian Patriarch and one of the Archbishops in America said there was no communion and Bishop Gabriel of ROCOR-L said ROCOR-L is not in communion with the JP or Serbia, only your synod. Of course, as we know from your synods own letter, that communion is passing the point of economia and will be broken upon the ROCOR-L and MP union.

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George Australia
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Post by George Australia »

Deacon Nikolai wrote:
George Australia wrote:

The Pope is certainly not currently on the Dyptych of Constantinople- whose Dyptich is he on?

When I get home, if I have the time, I will try to find the thread where the Vatican and either EP Meletius or EP Athenagoras said otherwise.

I'll save you the trouble, it was Athenagoras. The pope has subsequently been removed by Patriarch Demetrius in response to the protests of the Synodion of the Athonite Fathers- that is why I specified "not currently".

Deacon Nikolai wrote:

As for the back door communion, it remins unclear when the Serbian Patriarch and one of the Archbishops in America said there was no communion and Bishop Gabriel of ROCOR-L said ROCOR-L is not in communion with the JP or Serbia, only your synod. Of course, as we know from your synods own letter, that communion is passing the point of economia and will be broken upon the ROCOR-L and MP union.

Aren't these really moot points and irrelevant? We are not in Communion with the Patrichate of Constantinople either- but as I said, we don't consider them "Graceless" or schismatic. Whom we are or are not in Sacramental Communion with is no reflection on their position as being in or outside the Body of Christ.
At the time of the Second Ecumenical Council, Antioch had two bishops, Paulinus and Meletius. Rome recognised only Paulinus and considered Meletius a "schismatic". This council was under the presidency of Meletius whom Rome did not recognise, and who died during the Council. Meletius is now "St. Meletius" in both the East and the West.
No matter how many historical examples I bring up of similar situations to what we find ourselves in today, neither yourself nor OOD are satisfied. We say the situation is not clear, you guys see it as black-and-white. What more can I say? You administer this forum, do whatever you want with it.
George

"As long as it depends on Monothelitism, then Miaphysitism is nothing but a variant of Monophysitism."

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Chrysostomos
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Post by Chrysostomos »

No matter how many historical examples I bring up of similar situations to what we find ourselves in today, neither yourself nor OOD are satisfied. We say the situation is not clear, you guys see it as black-and-white. What more can I say? You administer this forum, do whatever you want with it.

George Australia,

This really shouldn't surprise you or any of us. For either Father Deacon or OOD to do otherwise, would really take away any reason for their not being in their respective jurisdictions. It is because of these very "arguments" that those jurisdictions were formed. Take away the arguments and you take away their respective jurisdiction's purpose for existence.

Let alone the ability that allows us so easily to fall into prelest due to our feelings of superiority over one another. My Church is the True Church, your Church is not. Therefore, I know better, and you do not. I think it is that desire to find the "True Church" and that individuals get sidetracked as to the original purpose for our search, salvation through Jesus Christ. A person can pick and choose which Canons they wish to impress are the most important, and will shy away from those that don't go with their "cause".

Perfect example is Archbishop Gregory. Now part of the "True Orthodox Church of Bulgaria". He, I have no doubt can quote canons better than Father Deacon and OOD combined. His debating with them, would no doubt have him be the winner, but does that make him right? Has his continual hopping from one jurisdiction glorified God? Has the divisions cause by this "hopping", brought much fruit?

Where is the fruit of the Spirit in all this? Where is the love? Where is the compassion? Where is the HUMILITY? We just got done with the Publican and Pharisee... Reading this board, it appears that from many postings it appears to be more in vogue to be a Pharisee than a publican. The Publican couldn't even raise his eyes, and says, as we all should say - Lord be merciful to me a sinner. Rather, the Pharisee is the model, and the mode by which many operate. Myself included.

I hate when I get caught up into the "Pharisee model". I find myself better left to the study of Hesychasm and doing the Jesus Prayer, trying to love my brothers and sisters, having compassion, and not get full of myself. When I see others doing it, yes, like OOD and Father Deacon, in regards to their posts, it disturbs me, because maybe I don't do it in this regards, but I do it in many other ways in life in general.

I realize my own sinfulness and how far away from the mark I am. That in reality, the closer we get to God, the more sinful we recognize ourselves being, and the less we focus on the short-coming of others.

Bottom Line: I guess I really thought Traditional Orthodoxy was about your life in Christ, how you live, piety, holiness, being a living icon.
What I find instead, rules and regulations, canons, division, judgement.
Frankly, it's saddening.

Okay - let me put on my armor! :)

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joasia
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Post by joasia »

Lord have mercy. Too many cooks in the kitchen. :roll:

As a convert, I would just like to know where the true church of Christ is.

I'm fed up with this bickering of synods. It's the fault of the hierarchy, plain and simple.

Let me make it simple for you gents...ecumenism is evil, stick with tradition, including the old calendar(which should never have been changed) and anyone that preaches the opposite of the Seven Ecumenical Councils are traitors to God.

And they say women are complicated. Sheesshhh.

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尼古拉前执事
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Lord Jesus Christ Son of God have mercy on me a sinner!

Post by 尼古拉前执事 »

I was hoping that this thread would only be an explanation of a reason for a new section which I found to be a positive as it would move most of the polemics to one section that a person could then easily avoid polemics at the Café. I apologize to anyone who became scandalized in my further attempts to try to clarify this, which sadly ended up becoming polemical, which I had hoped to avoid coming from my mouth or fingers.

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Liudmilla
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Post by Liudmilla »

How about we retire this thread til after Easter........Gives us time to cool off....rethink....take a deeeeeeep breath......concentrate on Lent....etc

Milla

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joasia
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Post by joasia »

Fr. Nicholai

I think the moderators are doing a commendable job. The proof is that I still come back. It takes alot of courage to keep this up.

And if some certain people don't like it, then they can create their own cafe.

We may not all agree, but we have the freedom to disagree. It is a time of great confusion. I still think the hierarchs have to get their act together.

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