George,
Who says Orthodoxy is apophatic? Besides, didn't you know that all the explanations of God are taught through the true Orthodox teachings, which...by the way are logical, as they are created by God who created logic and order?
Everything in this created world can be explained by God's logic. That is what I meant about Orthodoxy being logical.
You're side steps are amusing.
Create in me a clean heart, O God, and renew a right spirit within me. (Ps. 50)
Joasia wrote:CGW.
The rules of logic start with the Orthodox. Anything else is less than logic.
Here we are about to fall into the "why I am still a Protestant" line of argument that we seem to inevitably reach whenever we start talking about logic and authority. For the sake of the forum I will cut that development short. Nonetheless I think it should be allowed a little progress.
Logic does not come from the Orthodox. It comes from God, and it is manifest in the world to all. Logic is manifest, as heat and light are manifest, as water flows and boils and freezes, as the sun shines and the moon moves. When a cleric or a layman tries to claim logic for his own church, he has given up truth. The only genuine reason to believe truth is because it is true. When one says, "Believe this, not because I can show it is true, but because you have to in order to be among the elect," one has handed over faith to the Father of Lies.
Read the Holy Fathers. They are the foundation of Christianity.
As I seem to have to say over and over here, neither you nor I am a Church Father. Having read the Fathers-- and not only the Fathers, but Scripture itself and those who came after the Fathers, in all the many traditions-- both you and I are still stuck with the problem of reasoning about them. As soon as one says, "this means...", one is reasoning: participating in logic. I should feel no compulsion to be swayed by the reasoning of one who denies the value of logic and who indeed has a history of grievous errors of fact.
For instance: you cited at one point the Protocols of the Elders of Zion. This work is known to be a fraud. I believe we went through a similar argument about creationism; at this moment I am not moved sufficiently to chase back through the threads to find it. And just recently you were chastizing Mr. Reeves out of your dead certainty that the doctrine of Papal Infallibility teaches that the pope is sinless, which it most certainly does not (and which Mr. Reeves, having been Catholic, is in a much better position as an expert than you are).
If you can't get your facts straight, why in Heaven should I place any credence in your rendition of the Fathers? Even a D.P. such as myself knows that Christianity is founded, not in the Fathers, but in JESUS. Scriptures teach this, and I expect that the Fathers teach this. So why are you teaching otherwise?
Cizinec,
I am told - I do not speak Arabic - that the word 'Allah' is the Arabic word for God. If we accept that and move on to a comparison between the New Testament and Al Qu'ran we may find an answer.........
THE KORAN
The similitude of Jesus before God is as that of Adam; He created him from dust, then said to him: "Be"; And he was. (Sura 3, 59)
THE NEW TESTAMENT
In the beinning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God, All things were made by Him; and without Him was not anything made that was made..... And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the Only-begotten of the Father), full of grace and truth. (John 1, 1-3, 14)
THE KORAN
They do blaspheme who say: "God is Christ the son of Mary..." They do blaspheme who say: God is one of three in a Trinity, for there is no god except One God. If they desist not from their word (of blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them. (Sura 5, 75 & 78)
THE NEW TESTAMENT
All power is given Me in Heaven and on earth. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the Name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit: taching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of time. Amen. (Matthew 28, 18-20)
No one, reading the texts given above could in reason conclude that the 'God' moslems worship and God that we worship are one and the same.
