What is Wrong With Cyprianism?

[Joe Zollars]

does this officially constitute a miracle? ok folks whose feastday is it.

Joe Zollars

[Mor Ephrem]

I agree with what Justin, Julianna, and Anastasios agree with in this thread, and have agreed with it for some time now because it is the only logical conclusion unless you operate with different rules. I don't know if this constitutes a miracle, though. Perhaps the four horsemen of the Apocalypse?

[Nektarios14]

It's not really a miracle that we all agree it just shows we all share in possessing a great enough cognitive ability to see rank hypocrisy. The hardliners within the ROCOR (the TOCs in communion with the ROCOR) don't have a leg to stand on since they are at the end of the day in communion with dreaded heretics known as "world Orthodoxy." While I don't agree with the position of the GOC, ROAC etc. there beliefs do at least make reasonable sense and aren't contradictory. The beliefs of the moderates within the ROCOR also makes sense and aren't contradictory. It is those who blast those in communion with the EP as being graceless heretics yet are in full communion with the same that make me wonder if they are playing with a full deck...

[Joe Zollars]

it was just a joke folks. It is bizarre when Julianna and Anastasios and Paradosis all agree on something ecclesial.

Joe Zollars

[Justin Kissel]

It's not really a miracle that we all agree it just shows we all share in possessing a great enough cognitive ability to see rank hypocrisy.

I dare not go that far. Somehow, my bishops, including Met. Laurus, have come to a different conclusion. It is proper to seek understanding of the apparent lapse (in consistency), not to rashly judge my bishops as being incompetent. (I realise that you did not make this charge, but if I agree with you this is what I'll essentially be thinking about my bishops).

[Monk George]

"Those who attack the Church of Christ by teaching that Christ's Church is divided into so-called "branches" which differ in doctrine and way of life, or that the Church does not exist visibly, but will be formed in the future when all "branches" or sects or denominations, and even religions will be united into one body;

and who do not distinguish the priesthood and mysteries of the Church from those of the heretics, but say that the baptism and eucharist of heretics is effectual for salvation;

therefore, to those who knowingly have communion with these aforementioned heretics or who advocate, disseminate, or defend their new heresy of Ecumenism under the pretext of brotherly love or the supposed unification of separated Christians, Anathema!"

The Russian Church Abroad's Anathema on Ecumenism.

++++++++++++++++

From the above italic portion, it is clear that the ecclesiology of Metropolitan Cyprian has been anathematized by at least the Russian Church Abroad.

As Bishop Gregory Grabbe pointed out, what is so paradoxical is that the ROCA synodally adopted the ecclesiology of Metropolitan Cyprian in 1994, thus placing themselves under their own anathema, as fearful as it may be.

Our Vladyka Gregory was the first to use the term "holy heretics", which is precisely what Cyprian teaches. Either we are the Church, or they are: it cannot be that the Holy Spirit resides in both, contradicting Himself, Saint Firmilian, the close companion of St. Cyprian of Carthage wrote in his treatise to Cyprian.

The Lord prophesied of our times in the Apocalypse, writing to the Church of the Laodiceans that they were neither hot nor cold. For souls seeking to find the truth, Cyprian should have had the love to tell them that truth, rather than teach them that they can safely remain outside the Ark and still find refuge from the deluge of heresy surrounding us.

The Lord warned the Prophet Ezekiel that He had set him as a watchman for the house of Israel. Should he cower before warning the sinners, or shrink back from warning the righteous, he would incur the spiritual blood of these men.

Saint John Chrysostom explains that the priesthood is the watchman of the new Israel, the Church. Rather than point out the path which leads to life, Cyprianism calls death life, and life death.

Fr. George

[Noah]

Nicholas,

I know that one of the differences between ROCOR/Synod in Resistance/Old Calanderist Bulgarian/Old Calander Romanion and the rest of the "uncanonical" anti-ecumenists is the recognition of grace and validity in the ecumenical Orthodox churches. But is this where his "error" ends? Aside from slanders, I never hear from (and admittedly have not knocked myself out searching for) ROAC reps just what IS the problem with Metropolitan Cyprian. Could you elaborate, or point me to a thread where these things are elaborated?

Thanks,
Noah

BTW: If having your hierarchs ebrace a heresy is enough to revoke grace from all of their sacraments given to their faithful, and they are all to be considered immediately outside of the church, what was the point of any of the ecumenical councils? Why would the church fathers expell those already expelled? And why on earth would they have a council (synod) with those outside of the church? It sounds to me that they were all "rabid ecumenists"!