THE RUSSIAN IS THE SERB’S FRIEND FOREVER?

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Ekklisiastikos
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Re: THE RUSSIAN IS THE SERB’S FRIEND FOREVER?

Post by Ekklisiastikos »

Despotovac wrote:

In this way, faithful people are offended and intimidated and from this it is well shown how harmful this, temporary episcopacy of Greek bishops, was for Serbia

Why fr. Akakios shows such ungratefulness?

Despotovac wrote:

Assertions like this are not new, the Parish of Smederevo has spread such information’s for several years now.

Why is fr. Akakios sowing discord not only among Greeks and Serbs but also among orthodox brethren inside Serbia?

Despotovac wrote:

What canonical release is in question and where are the Serbian priests going to and why ask canonical release from Greek bishops?

What (or who..?) made fr. Akakios stop being faithful and obedient to his lawful Synod and hierarchy?

Despotovac wrote:

Some Serbs, alas, claim that Greek old-calendarists have made some new “Serbian church” that has nothing to do with Saint Sava`s Serbian Church
The assertion that Serbian Church has disappeared and that it has to be restored from the beginning like Greek mission among Aborigines or African tribes is totally absurd.
They need this Schism to justify Greek faceless exarchate on canonical territory of Serbia.

Why is fr. Akakios trying to charge to his lawful hierarchy his OWN assertions? The Orthodox Church of Christ (!) in the territory of Serbia is under restoration a quite time now, and it is a wish of all TOChristians to see the Orthodox Church in Serbia (and not the Serbian Church) to the glory of St. Savvas' era with episcopacy and parishes and monasteries! And of course the presence of a bishop would promote this pleasing to God task! But let's all let the Synod decide.

Despotovac wrote:

It is true, though that we, Serbian priests are temporarily under administrative rule of Holy Synod of Greek TOC, but only until Serbia receives its own bishop.

Let's be frank! "own bishop"..i.e. fr. Akakios? Who elected him? Who anointed him as the only candidate? Were there any council in Serbia where all the parishes participated and elected him?

Despotovac wrote:

Serbian priests were ordained by Greek TOC as help of Greek Church to sister- Church in Serbia[...] Even today`s Archbishop became a bishop overnight when bishops Kalist and Antony made an exemplary schism

Let us also remind to fr. Akakios that this "overnight consecrated" Archbishop Kallinikos baptized and ordained him a priest and by his blessings was sent to Serbia, an empty area from True Orthodox people, for missionary reasons.., instead of keeping him serving in a monastery of Greece.

Despotovac wrote:

Everything and anything is being written these days. Serbs are always in disagreement.

This makes profound that fr. Akakios is already determined! and for what thing is determined to..! even if RTOC denies to cooperate at last..
Let us make our own assertion now. Someone next to fr. Akakios has swollen his head and forces him to take up the hall matter on his own shoulders unilaterally as if all the Serbian clerics and faithful unanimously has asked him so! Otherwise we can't explain such a tremendous turn 180 degrees and changing to his character and way of thinking!

Priest Siluan wrote:

I find very right the Father Akakije`s clarification about this important question for the the true and canonical Serbian Orthodox Church, and it is very interesting that some people in GOC are forgetting their own story and their own past.

fr. Siluan your blessings. The history of TOC of Greece has nothing to do with the "Serbian matter". These are two different stories. In Greece there was a continuation of True Orthodoxy even after the schism of 1924 . And back in 60's there was an already established and organized Orthodox Church which was left without bishops. And it was at the second panhellenic counsil of TOC clergy and faithful where they elected the candidates and decided to whom to turn for help.

http://translate.google.gr/translate?js ... -1955.html

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Re: THE RUSSIAN IS THE SERB’S FRIEND FOREVER?

Post by Priest Siluan »

Ekklisiastikos wrote:
Priest Siluan wrote:

I find very right the Father Akakije`s clarification about this important question for the the true and canonical Serbian Orthodox Church, and it is very interesting that some people in GOC are forgetting their own story and their own past.

fr. Siluan your blessings. The history of TOC of Greece has nothing to do with the "Serbian matter". These are two different stories. In Greece there was a continuation of True Orthodoxy even after the schism of 1924 . And back in 60's there was an already established and organized Orthodox Church which was left without bishops. And it was at the second panhellenic counsil of TOC clergy and faithful where they elected the candidates and decided to whom to turn for help.

http://translate.google.gr/translate?js ... -1955.html

Dear in Christ, Ekklisiastikos,

God may bless you!

You are right about this point about the TOC in Greece, everything was did in a "Counciliar mind". My point was rather about the attitude of the Russian toward the Greeks, it was not clear and "Counciliar" until 1969.

In Christ,

unworthy,

Priest Siluan

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Re: THE RUSSIAN IS THE SERB’S FRIEND FOREVER?

Post by Ђура Јт »

Sorry about any bad grammar , this is my first post i hope to get it right

Ekklisiastikos wrote:
Despotovac wrote:

In this way, faithful people are offended and intimidated and from this it is well shown how harmful this, temporary episcopacy of Greek bishops, was for Serbia

Why fr. Akakios shows such ungratefulness?

Where do you see ungratefulness in the lines above, fr Akakios is referring to nonsense of ''new Serbian church'' and how belivers in Serbia react on it.

Despotovac wrote:

Assertions like this are not new, the Parish of Smederevo has spread such information’s for several years now.

Why is fr. Akakios sowing discord not only among Greeks and Serbs but also among orthodox brethren inside Serbia?

The parish of Smederevo is acting in a specific way for at least 7 or 8 years now, in a spirit of a debate about nonsense of ''new Serbian church'' this also needed to be mentioned, so who ever was sowing discord, did his chores well couple of years before.

Despotovac wrote:

What canonical release is in question and where are the Serbian priests going to and why ask canonical release from Greek bishops?

What (or who..?) made fr. Akakios stop being faithful and obedient to his lawful Synod and hierarchy?

Who made Holy Synod to completely forget about us: only two official visits from His Grace the archbishop Kalinikos in more then 10 years, no reply to any of our many letters about our problems, not even one epistle during all this time, or even a postcard nothing... why?

Despotovac wrote:

Some Serbs, alas, claim that Greek old-calendarists have made some new “Serbian church” that has nothing to do with Saint Sava`s Serbian Church
The assertion that Serbian Church has disappeared and that it has to be restored from the beginning like Greek mission among Aborigines or African tribes is totally absurd.
They need this Schism to justify Greek faceless exarchate on canonical territory of Serbia.

Why is fr. Akakios trying to charge to his lawful hierarchy his OWN assertions? The Orthodox Church of Christ (!) in the territory of Serbia is under restoration a quite time now, and it is a wish of all TOChristians to see the Orthodox Church in Serbia (and not the Serbian Church) to the glory of St. Savvas' era with episcopacy and parishes and monasteries! And of course the presence of a bishop would promote this pleasing to God task! But let's all let the Synod decide.

OK we are waiting...

Despotovac wrote:

It is true, though that we, Serbian priests are temporarily under administrative rule of Holy Synod of Greek TOC, but only until Serbia receives its own bishop.

Let's be frank! "own bishop"..i.e. fr. Akakios? Who elected him? Who anointed him as the only candidate? Were there any council in Serbia where all the parishes participated and elected him?


Yes, actually there were..., but how would you know that, who are other candidates in your opinion...

Despotovac wrote:

Serbian priests were ordained by Greek TOC as help of Greek Church to sister- Church in Serbia[...] Even today`s Archbishop became a bishop overnight when bishops Kalist and Antony made an exemplary schism

Let us also remind to fr. Akakios that this "overnight consecrated" Archbishop Kallinikos baptized and ordained him a priest and by his blessings was sent to Serbia, an empty area from True Orthodox people, for missionary reasons.., instead of keeping him serving in a monastery of Greece.

Not true check again... missionary reasons :? ... so you actually do think we are Africa thanks /\ .

Despotovac wrote:

Everything and anything is being written these days. Serbs are always in disagreement.

This makes profound that fr. Akakios is already determined! and for what thing is determined to..! even if RTOC denies to cooperate at last..
Let us make our own assertion now. Someone next to fr. Akakios has swollen his head and forces him to take up the hall matter on his own shoulders unilaterally as if all the Serbian clerics and faithful unanimously has asked him so! Otherwise we can't explain such a tremendous turn 180 degrees and changing to his character and way of thinking!

Again you are wrong this is not a turn but going straight ahead, and that someone next to fr Akakios is Us the believers from Serbian TOC, why wouldn't RTOC cooperate they did before...

Believer from Serbian TOC

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Re: THE RUSSIAN IS THE SERB’S FRIEND FOREVER?

Post by Ekklisiastikos »

Ђура Јт wrote:

Where do you see ungratefulness in the lines above, fr Akakios is referring to nonsense of ''new Serbian church'' and how belivers in Serbia react on it.

In other words he wrote that: The "Greek" Synod did harm to the Serbian folk all this years instead of good..

Ђура Јт wrote:

Who made Holy Synod to completely forget about us: only two official visits from His Grace the archbishop Kalinikos in more then 10 years, no reply to any of our many letters about our problems, not even one epistle during all this time, or even a postcard nothing... why?

That's interesting because every time Bp. Photius was visiting you..we were reading at the articles that he was doing so with the blessings of the then Met. Kallinikos who is weak for many long distance trips. And if he was not doing so..we read about a council of Serbian priests now he is an Archbishop..(In no ways we are trying to excuse any mistakes there were made..)

Ђура Јт wrote:

Yes, actually there were..., but how would you know that, who are other candidates in your opinion...

Pray to God to indicate them!

Ђура Јт wrote:

Not true check again... missionary reasons :? ... so you actually do think we are Africa thanks /\ .

What is not true?
Africa? you said so! But since you were baptized, married and ordained from the beginning, in the right way by canonic priests and thus you entered in the Church of Christ, well YES this is missionary work and we are happy and proud of you (our brothers) and we praise God for the work is done in Serbia so far on the restoration of the Orthodox Church there!

Ђура Јт wrote:

Again you are wrong this is not a turn but going straight ahead, and that someone next to fr Akakios is Us the believers from Serbian TOC

I hope with this you are not admitting that you (those around fr. Akakios) are who nurture hero-worshipping to him and not a specific person...

Two last words in this thread and then we stop posting: The nationality of a priest is not a reason to abandon his lawful Bishop. A layman or even a priest alone can't stand as a Church without his obedience to an Orthodox bishop.
We pray to God, the "Serbian matter" won't constitute an obstacle to the forthcoming union of the Russian and Greek Orthodox Churches but to see these "neighbouring True Orthodox Churches to give the Serbian Church a bishop" in a joint concelebration in the near future as Vladimir wrote...

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Re: THE RUSSIAN IS THE SERB’S FRIEND FOREVER?

Post by Priest Siluan »

Ekklisiastikos wrote:

We pray to God, the "Serbian matter" won't constitute an obstacle to the forthcoming union of the Russian and Greek Orthodox Churches but to see these "neighbouring True Orthodox Churches to give the Serbian Church a bishop" in a joint concelebration in the near future as Vladimir wrote...

Amen and God may grant us such a great blessing!

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Re: THE RUSSIAN IS THE SERB’S FRIEND FOREVER?

Post by Ђура Јт »

In other words he wrote that: The "Greek" Synod did harm to the Serbian folk all this years instead of good..

No, Greek Synod helped us and we all know it and we are grateful, ''in other words '' is only your impression.

That's interesting because every time Bp. Photius was visiting you..we were reading at the articles that he was doing so with the blessings of the then Met. Kallinikos who is weak for many long distance trips. And if he was not doing so..we read about a council of Serbian priests now he is an Archbishop..(In no ways we are trying to excuse any mistakes there were made..)

That IS interesting, after 11 years first visit by any bishop, (to bishop Photius we are truly grateful). Met Kalinikos was weak , way didn't he let Bp Photius be our regular Bishop with authority, we had a regular meeting in which we voted for this and then came in Corinth and got His blessing for this change....and then ....nothing , we went home and our Bishop was to our surprise still met Kallinikos, and (btw our favorite) Bp Photius WAS visiting us but without any authority to change anything.

Pray to God to indicate them!

We already did thank you.

Africa? you said so! But since you were baptized, married and ordained from the beginning, in the right way by canonic priests and thus you entered in the Church of Christ, well YES this is missionary work and we are happy and proud of you (our brothers) and we praise God for the work is done in Serbia so far on the restoration of the Orthodox Church there!

But what about our elder believers that were all baptized and married in Serbian Church before ecumenism and that are now with us what are they?
P.S It is not true that Met Kalinikos had anything to do with fr Akakios leaving for Serbia neither he could made him stay in any monastery, this part you should check again.

Two last words in this thread and then we stop posting: The nationality of a priest is not a reason to abandon his lawful Bishop. A layman or even a priest alone can't stand as a Church without his obedience to an Orthodox bishop.
We pray to God, the "Serbian matter" won't constitute an obstacle to the forthcoming union of the Russian and Greek Orthodox Churches but to see these "neighbouring True Orthodox Churches to give the Serbian Church a bishop" in a joint concelebration in the near future as Vladimir wrote...

I am pleasantly surprised that you changed your stand about Serbian bishop, why stop let's carry on... :D

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Re: THE RUSSIAN IS THE SERB’S FRIEND FOREVER?

Post by Suaidan »

My only question is: what is holding back the Synod (whether the GOC or the RTOC) from making a Bishop for Serbia if there is already a candidate?

If they did it together, it would be a great boon for True Orthodoxy.

Fr Joseph Suaidan (Suaiden, same guy)

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