excessive laughter

[TomS]

Dear Tom,

As we get older we do loose our innocence. Our innocent laughter becomes ironic laughter or even gossiping laughter etc.

Ahhh! No we are getting somewhere!

So am I sinning when I laugh with my son? That's a redundant question, I already know the answer.

So are you modifying the blanket statement that laughing is a sin, to be "laughing at someone elses expense and misfortune is a sin?"

Is that what you are trying to say? 'Casue that does fit mainstream Orthodoxy!

One would have to ask what denomination are you? You seem to argue nearly everything!

What does it matter what jurisdiction of Orthodoxy I am? But if you need to know, it would be GOA. And I will constantly argue against the fringe, radical beliefs. Such as THIS belief. Fanatacism is the work of Satan.

Joanna is stating the facts according to our Orthodox faith.

Nonsense. She is stating a fringe belief that has not been a part of the Orthodoxy that I am aware of. It is part of the depressing wing of the Russian Orthodox. From a culture that has been through so much pain and suffering that this type of belief is used as a coping device to explain their misery.

And bye the way, our Mother Mary, was humble. She never laughed at anyone, but covered all that she saw with her love. She never made silly movements, nor took unrestrained steps. She spoke very little, only what was necessary and good. Her words were sweet to the ear. She never got angry and made her whole soul a holy shrine of meekness.

This is simply conjecture.

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Okay. I am done. No reason to debate this any further.

Be happy and enjoy life! Life is a gift from God - and not just when we are children! To squander this gift IS a grave sin!

[ANGELA]

Joanna,

Thanks for all your info. It is the truth. Our Theotkos did not laugh. I am also reading the Life of the Theotokos and it is fantastic!

Tom,

What can I say? When the going gets tuff the tuff get going! I have noticed that you twist evryone's words. The TRUTH is the TRUTH! Maybe you should be speaking to your Spiritual Father.

Anyway it is not a fringe belief what Joanna is saying. I am Greek Orthodox and we believe the same thing.

Anyway may both of you have a Blessed Pascha!

Angela+++

[Ebor]

Angela,
And the many hymns describe situations like her first birthday. And all these sources definitely describe her as having never laughed.

Do they say that St. Mary never laughed or do they not mention laughing at all?

Much of this seems to be arguing from silence. Just because something is not stated, it does not mean that it never happened or doesn't exist. To use an example, Japan and China are never mentioned in the Scriptures. But they do and did exist. Therefor to say that "there never was a China because Jesus or others in the Bible didn't say it did would be false.

Ebor

[joasia]

Ebor,

The descriptions of the holy Theotokos describe her as the purest of creation. Her humility exceeded anyone that ever existed. St. Gregory Palamas described her as the model of hesychatic life. She is the first to have taken on unceasing prayer.

To read the descriptions of her character, a person would come to understand that laughter was not one of her expressions. It's only logical to understand that. She is the most humble and purest of creation.

When you prayer, Ebor, do you laugh in between prayers? In church, during Liturgy, do we see the priests laugh in between prayers? When the saints who practiced unceasing prayer...did they laugh?

It's a matter of spiritual logic that laughter has no place during prayer and therefore because the holy Theotokos prayed unceasingly...would she laugh? And for that matter, would Christ who is God?

St John described her as being constantly advanced to perfection. She had an extraordinary pure life. She never allowed an unclean thought.

She was the first person to start greeting others with the phrase, Thanks Be to God or Glory be to God.

If she had laughed, it would have been mentioned by the saints. But, laughing is an emotion due to the state of our fall. It is a twisted form of joy. It amazes me how people can't make the connection between the descriptions of her pure humility and the fact that laughter was not part of her expressions. It's understood by the saints' descriptions.

The Bible also doesn't mention how old the Theotokos was when she was betrothed to Joseph. And it doesn't mention that Joseph was 80 and she was 12 or 13. And it doesn't mention the way that the priest Zacharias arranged for the Theotokos to be betrothed. But, these facts are known in the Orthodox faith. It has been preserved and passed down by the saints.

Do some research and see for yourself.

Joanna

[ANGELA]

Well said!!!