The Saint Euphrosynos Cafe

Why do some single Orthodox date those who are Heterodox? Being an inquirer into Orthodoxy coming from conservative Protestantism, I don't understand this. Scripture states in 2 Corinthians 6:14 "Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers; for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness?" When I was Protestant I would have NEVER even considered dating someone who didn't share the same faith as I did; that is THE most important thing to have in common when dating (in a relationship which may eventually lead to marriage), in my mind. Less "fundamentalist" Protestants, however, wouldn't share this view and would have no problem dating someone of a different faith tradition. They might even consider such dating as "missionary dating" in the hopes that their boyfriend/girlfriend would be influenced by their faith and want to "convert" or switch denominations.

One of the single adults at the church I attend (who is Orthodox) is dating a person who is Protestant and on occasion has brought them to liturgy (and I'm glad that this visitor is being exposed to the Orthodox faith); this situation is what raised this question for me.

You have a point. Some of the problem may be because, especially in True Orthodoxy, our numbers are very small. I think also it's hard to avoid getting to know people outside your church and your faith, and a lot of what attracts people to each other has nothing to do with religion. So yes, Orthodox men and women should generally avoid dating outside their faith, but the explanation for why they do is not hard to figure out.

Handmaiden,

I got a little off track there, but I do want to ask you about the "Unequally yoked" slogan. I heard a Nazarene,
if that's what a member of their group is called, endlessly talk about that regarding a guy with whom she ended up eventually marrying - in a lukewarm back terrace "ceremony".
For years, though, she had complained constantly to this guy using that term as a way to berate, it seemed. It was a sort-of-friend, not really a good friend, but who confided in me about this.
I knew about the Bible verse. But is there a stronger connotation to this phrase, whereby it becomes a catch-phrase ?

And you say that it's only conservative Protestants who go by this maxim.
I guess Nazarenes must be included in that number.
Which others would be likely to adhere to it ?

If you don't have too much information about this, don't worry. Just seeking insight in case you do. It was always perplexing to hear of the categorical condemnation of the person I knew by just this particular expression, as though that said everything in a nutshell. Not about religion, even, but every last aspect of life.
Does this case seem at all typical, or just one rare example of almost putting a person down by claiming an "unequal yoke".

{After Maria's post about how dye Easter eggs in the Praxis forum, I picture in my mind 2 yolks which are dissimilar in diameter, shade of yellow, etc - !

Barbara wrote:

Handmaiden,

I got a little off track there, but I do want to ask you about the "Unequally yoked" slogan. I heard a Nazarene,
if that's what a member of their group is called, endlessly talk about that regarding a guy with whom she ended up eventually marrying - in a lukewarm back terrace "ceremony".
For years, though, she had complained constantly to this guy using that term as a way to berate, it seemed. It was a sort-of-friend, not really a good friend, but who confided in me about this.
I knew about the Bible verse. But is there a stronger connotation to this phrase, whereby it becomes a catch-phrase ?

And you say that it's only conservative Protestants who go by this maxim.
I guess Nazarenes must be included in that number.
Which others would be likely to adhere to it ?

If you don't have too much information about this, don't worry. Just seeking insight in case you do. It was always perplexing to hear of the categorical condemnation of the person I knew by just this particular expression, as though that said everything in a nutshell. Not about religion, even, but every last aspect of life.
Does this case seem at all typical, or just one rare example of almost putting a person down by claiming an "unequal yoke".

{After Maria's post about how dye Easter eggs in the Praxis forum, I picture in my mind 2 yolks which are dissimilar in diameter, shade of yellow, etc - !

Within Protestantism (as in other Christian traditions) in general there are folks who are more "conservative" (fundamentalist, take the Bible literally) and more "liberal" (those who would view parts of the Bible as cultural to that time/era and possibly not relevant for today).

By "unequally yoked" (and you imagining 2 egg yolks that were dissimilar was cute, BTW) it is using the example of yoking or pairing up two animals of the same kind (oxen or horses) to work together to plow a field or some other task, as a picture of the marriage relationship (and would also be applied in choosing one's close friends).

(From my understanding of your example above) I guess there may be those who take this idea of being unequally yoked (in the context of dating/marriage) and judge others or become all Pharisaical and put others down who they would deem an "unbeliever" or someone not in agreement with their religious belief system; that is very unfortunate and doesn't exhibit a very loving spirit.

Other things to consider:

• Cultural incompatibility: if you're a convert in an ethnic parish, there may be cultural or linguistic barriers, even if you share the same faith. When I joined True Orthodoxy, I was told I would probably never get married since I wasn't ethnically Greek.

• Lack of matchmakers: lots of traditional religious communities have dedicated matchmakers that can arrange and chaperone meetings between prospective spouses. But when you have communities as small as TO ones, they often lack such resources. It can be awkward for men to approach women in their parish on their own and they may feel more comfortable approaching women outside Church, since they won't have to keep interacting with them if it doesn't work out.

jgress wrote:

Other things to consider:

• Cultural incompatibility: if you're a convert in an ethnic parish, there may be cultural or linguistic barriers, even if you share the same faith. When I joined True Orthodoxy, I was told I would probably never get married since I wasn't ethnically Greek.

• Lack of matchmakers: lots of traditional religious communities have dedicated matchmakers that can arrange and chaperone meetings between prospective spouses. But when you have communities as small as TO ones, they often lack such resources. It can be awkward for men to approach women in their parish on their own and they may feel more comfortable approaching women outside Church, since they won't have to keep interacting with them if it doesn't work out.

I'm commenting as someone who attends a "World Orthodox" church (as there are no TO churches near me to attend) and within a 2 hour drive there are several parishes of varying jurisdictions, so there would be the potential for singles (if they were to visit for liturgy or other functions) to meet others who are Orthodox, yet not in their parish. I can see where among those who are TO, with smaller congregations, it can be much more difficult to find a spouse who is also TO. Didn't know that matchmakers existed within TO . . . that's pretty cool!

It hurt my heart to read that someone actually commented to you when you converted that because you weren't ethnically Greek you would probably never get married within TO. OUCH!

Handmaiden50 wrote:

I'm commenting as someone who attends a "World Orthodox" church (as there are no TO churches near me to attend) and within a 2 hour drive there are several parishes of varying jurisdictions, so there would be the potential for singles (if they were to visit for liturgy or other functions) to meet others who are Orthodox, yet not in their parish. I can see where among those who are TO, with smaller congregations, it can be much more difficult to find a spouse who is also TO. Didn't know that matchmakers existed within TO . . . that's pretty cool!

Actually, TO churches don't have matchmakers in my (perhaps limited) experience; that was my point. Dating life would be a little easier if we had them! Other traditionalist communities with larger numbers, like Orthodox Jews or Mormons, go to great efforts to make sure their followers marry within the faith, and part of that involves matchmaking.

If you expand your search to World Orthodox churches, you definitely have more options, but unless you can persuade your prospective spouse to abandon World Orthodoxy you're in a similar bind to someone who is dating a heterodox Christian (or a non-Christian). I suppose the leap from World Orthodoxy to True Orthodoxy is a smaller one, but I can foresee issues when e.g. your spouse's relatives can't go to communion in your church, or don't even celebrate on the same calendar.

It hurt my heart to read that someone actually commented to you when you converted that because you weren't ethnically Greek you would probably never get married within TO. OUCH!

Yeah it was a little upsetting. And it's not entirely true; I know of marriages between Greeks and non-Greeks (one priest, who's Greek, has a Peruvian wife!). But the parish I joined initially (St Markella's in Astoria) is pretty heavily Greek. There are some converts but they're definitely a minority.

So yes, people should not marry outside the faith, but there are a lot of challenges to staying in the faith in this respect. If you're asking "why", I suppose the answer is similar to why people in general commit sin: it's easy to avoid sin when there's no temptation.