Flower girls during Holy Saturday Matins

Formerly "Intra-TOC Private Discussions."


User avatar
Jean-Serge
Protoposter
Posts: 1399
Joined: Fri 1 April 2005 11:04 am
Location: Paris (France)
Contact:

Re: Girl candle bearers during Holy Saturday matins

Post by Jean-Serge »

Maria wrote:

Is the presence of young modestly dressed flower girls on Palm Sunday or Holy Friday a recent innovation? There are variations in Russian and in Greek practices.

Why girls and not teenagers or elder ladies since the myrrophores were not that young?

Priidite, poklonimsja i pripadem ko Hristu.

User avatar
Maria
Archon
Posts: 8428
Joined: Fri 11 June 2004 8:39 pm
Faith: True Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: GOC
Location: USA

Re: Girl candle bearers during Holy Saturday matins

Post by Maria »

Jean-Serge wrote:
Maria wrote:

Is the presence of young modestly dressed flower girls on Palm Sunday or Holy Friday a recent innovation? There are variations in Russian and in Greek practices.

Why girls and not teenagers or elder ladies since the myrrophores were not that young?

Having teenagers or mature ladies processing around the tomb would really be an innovation that would raise serious eyebrows. Additionally, it would be a horrible distraction with the above-the-knee tight skirts and dresses worn by teens and mature women. :roll:

Did you notice in that picture that the young girls were dressed more modestly than their female escorts?

Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy on me a sinner.

User avatar
Jean-Serge
Protoposter
Posts: 1399
Joined: Fri 1 April 2005 11:04 am
Location: Paris (France)
Contact:

Re: Girl candle bearers during Holy Saturday matins

Post by Jean-Serge »

Maria wrote:

Did you notice in that picture that the young girls were dressed more modestly than their female escorts?

Yes I noticed. I have not written yet to the parish to ask for their explanation about this custom.

Priidite, poklonimsja i pripadem ko Hristu.

User avatar
joasia
Protoposter
Posts: 1858
Joined: Tue 29 June 2004 7:19 pm
Jurisdiction: RTOC
Location: Montreal

Re: Girl candle bearers during Holy Saturday matins

Post by joasia »

Christ is Risen!

I've seen this with the New Calendar Church. It's a blessing for the young girls to go under the Epitaphion. I always thought it was a Greek tradition. The Russians don't do it though. Actually, one of my first experiences in the Greek Church (World) was going to Church on Big Friday and I was encouraged to go under the Epitaphion by a Greek friend. I wasn't in the Church though. I wasn't even baptised. But, looking back, it was a foreshadowing of the path I would take towards Orthodoxy, but with the True Orthodox. And glory be to God for His guidance in my life, because I was baptised (in the GOC) on Pascha 1994, after the Agape Service and I have pictures of my baptism and the Epitaphion is in them. Looking at the pictures, I realized that what I did so many years ago, without understanding, was God slowly bringing me to the true faith. I am still in awe.

Joanna

Create in me a clean heart, O God, and renew a right spirit within me. (Ps. 50)

User avatar
Jean-Serge
Protoposter
Posts: 1399
Joined: Fri 1 April 2005 11:04 am
Location: Paris (France)
Contact:

Re: Girl candle bearers during Holy Saturday matins

Post by Jean-Serge »

Joasia, there is in fact a confusion. They don't go under the epitaPhion but around laying petals. In the Greek church, after the procession with the epitaphion, the epitaphion is hold at the entry at the church and anyone walks under it entering the church.

Priidite, poklonimsja i pripadem ko Hristu.

User avatar
Barbara
Protoposter
Posts: 4132
Joined: Sat 29 September 2012 6:03 pm

Re: Girl candle bearers during Holy Saturday matins

Post by Barbara »

Hmm !
Interesting that these girls are not likely to stay in church anyway after they turn of age ....that is revealing that no "gimmicks"
or inclusion in ceremonies are able to keep them interested.
At least not for very long apparently.

The whole use of the girls in the way shown in the picture seems alien.

Now I remember that Rocor had girls in UNIFORMS of scouts standing guard along with boys of the St George Pathfinders.
That was a nice sight and added to the general solemnity of the Holy Saturday liturgy.

Whereas this other style could be mistaken easily for a birthday party....don't you all think ?!

User avatar
Maria
Archon
Posts: 8428
Joined: Fri 11 June 2004 8:39 pm
Faith: True Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: GOC
Location: USA

Re: Girl candle bearers during Holy Saturday matins

Post by Maria »

Did 18th Century Holy Russia allow the Russian Navy and/or Army to guard Christ's Tomb?

Did the 8th Century Greeks allow their men in uniform to guard the Epitaphion?

On the evening of Good and Holy Friday and on Holy Saturday, I have seen men, women, and teenagers taking turn reading the Psalter at the chanter's stand and altar boys guarding the Epitaphion, but I do not understand the presence of Girl and Boy Scouts in full uniform.

Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy on me a sinner.

Post Reply