My Russian Orthodox dilemma

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сынок
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Re: My Russian Orthodox dilemma

Post by сынок »

Barbara wrote:

On a pleasant subject, how did your parents meet at the DP camp ?
And when they came here, what were their reactions? Like, was it difficult to adjust to the
cultural life [lack of, that is] and general society ? Or they didn't have too much trouble to assimilate ?
What about the language for your mother ? Sounds like your father already spoke English
as one of his 4 languages perhaps ?

Enough disclosure on my parental background ... with all the interest, maybe I'll write a book :) I will tell you though that they really disliked the west ... the crime, the deception, twisted Hollywood productions and behaviors, the obvious and apparent hatred and discrimination towards foreigners - especially Russians. It was very sad for me growing up to hear the longing to be back home. Even when there was a supposed 'amnasty' program implemented sometime post Gorbachev, father and the rest of the Russian community laughed at it. Neither my sister or I would dare travel to Russia to visit as tourists. As in most WW2 eastern families (and even today), the man would be the best speaker of a new language. The woman usually played the traditional roles of child raising, housekeeping etc ... no need to really grasp a new language in detail. Now, back to my search ... :D :D :D

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Maria
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Re: My Russian Orthodox dilemma

Post by Maria »

сынок wrote:
Barbara wrote:

On a pleasant subject, how did your parents meet at the DP camp ?
And when they came here, what were their reactions? Like, was it difficult to adjust to the
cultural life [lack of, that is] and general society ? Or they didn't have too much trouble to assimilate ?
What about the language for your mother ? Sounds like your father already spoke English
as one of his 4 languages perhaps ?

Enough disclosure on my parental background ... with all the interest, maybe I'll write a book :) I will tell you though that they really disliked the west ... the crime, the deception, twisted Hollywood productions and behaviors, the obvious and apparent hatred and discrimination towards foreigners - especially Russians. It was very sad for me growing up to hear the longing to be back home. Even when there was a supposed 'amnasty' program implemented sometime post Gorbachev, father and the rest of the Russian community laughed at it. Neither my sister or I would dare travel to Russia to visit as tourists. As in most WW2 eastern families (and even today), the man would be the best speaker of a new language. The woman usually played the traditional roles of child raising, housekeeping etc ... no need to really grasp a new language in detail. Now, back to my search ... :D :D :D

In Greece, the situation was sometimes reversed.

Yes, it is true that the husband would often come to America, get a job, send money to the wife and children, and then when he could afford a house, he would send money for his wife and children to come stay in America, so yes, the husband could speak better English than his wife, especially if he were involved in the import-export business.

However, just before and after World War I and World War II, many Greek families came to America together. Often the wife could speak more English than the husband, because she wanted to immigrate, so she learned quickly from her friends who had English speaking friends. When at Ellis Island or another entry port, the immigration official would ask the wife what her husband's name was, she would respond, "George," then when he would ask what his first name was, she would respond: "George." Since many immigrants barely understood English, and they could not hear the word "surname" but only heard "name," both the surname and the first name became the same. However, in the process of becoming a U.S. Citizen, it was better that they not change their names legally.

That is why there are a lot of folks here from Greece that have double names: George George, or Alexander Alexander, or even John John. Then there are those with the names John St. John. I guess that is another story.

Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy on me a sinner.

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сынок
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Re: My Russian Orthodox dilemma

Post by сынок »

Hello my dear friends!
I am sorry to have disappeared for the past week & a half or so but please let me explain!

The earlier banter about 'spies' really upset my thought patterns ... it even made me take down a picture I'd posted of my Christening. I had to re-think my approach to my posts.
In the time passed, I'd had a wonderful experience of chatting for an hour & a half with a ROCA priest in Ohio. What a privilege! Even though he reprimanded me for verbally slamming one of a different religious group of Russian Orthodox, I felt extremely special! He was clearly ill and not feeling well yet, he still answered questions and told me of events as though he was in perfect working order - what strength! :) Still, I have not made a choice!

All the TOC bishops and priests I've had contact with are well spoken, knowledgable , seemingly compassionate and, believable ... it makes my need for allegiance to one even stronger. I say 'seemingly' only because of my previous experience in a ROC which I attended and was fooled due to my own ignorance. Everyday, I try to repent and beg for forgiveness ...

Barbara; you innocently mentioned maybe a 'monastic' path after my hedonistic life of musicianship. Thanks for that but, after 4 children and 3 new grandchildren it's not too possible ... if you know what I mean.

Mark Templet
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Re: My Russian Orthodox dilemma

Post by Mark Templet »

My Friend,

It boils down to this: The ROC-MP is neck deep in ecumenism and sergianism; although there may be some nice people with sincere hearts within her walls, the core is rotten, period. It sounds like you have accepted that. Good!

This being the case, you have to find the Russian Church that has a crystal clear confession of Orthodoxy. In my opinion, this leaves you with a few options: ROAC, RTOC, or one of the ROCiE groups. To my knowledge, all of these agree on the fundamentals. You may ask, if that is the case, why are they not united? The answer is politics and the speed at which bishops do things. Decades of mistrust of outsiders and questioning the motivation of others while under the Soviet curse have breed great caution. This should not be looked at as a negative, but rather a complication of the situation. There is progress forward, but often it is two steps forward and one step back.

I joined ROAC for one central reason, they had a crystal clear confession; we even post it on our website http://www.roacusa.org/believe.php. This is not to say that the RTOC doesn't have such, just that at the time the clearest was ROAC. I have been happy with this decision. I bear no malice toward any of the other TOCs and in fact have many friends among their clergy and laity. So, I support you with whatever decision you make. May our Lord guide you!

Fr. Mark Templet
ROAC

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сынок
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Re: My Russian Orthodox dilemma

Post by сынок »

Mark Templet wrote:

My Friend,

It boils down to this: The ROC-MP is neck deep in ecumenism and sergianism; although there may be some nice people with sincere hearts within her walls, the core is rotten, period. It sounds like you have accepted that. Good!

This being the case, you have to find the Russian Church that has a crystal clear confession of Orthodoxy. In my opinion, this leaves you with a few options: ROAC, RTOC, or one of the ROCiE groups. To my knowledge, all of these agree on the fundamentals. You may ask, if that is the case, why are they not united? The answer is politics and the speed at which bishops do things. Decades of mistrust of outsiders and questioning the motivation of others while under the Soviet curse have breed great caution. This should not be looked at as a negative, but rather a complication of the situation. There is progress forward, but often it is two steps forward and one step back.

I joined ROAC for one central reason, they had a crystal clear confession; we even post it on our website http://www.roacusa.org/believe.php. This is not to say that the RTOC doesn't have such, just that at the time the clearest was ROAC. I have been happy with this decision. I bear no malice toward any of the other TOCs and in fact have many friends among their clergy and laity. So, I support you with whatever decision you make. May our Lord guide you!

Thank YOU Fr. Mark! I must let everyone know that you were the first person I directly contacted regarding the need for me to find my Orthodox roots. Like with the ROCie (ROCA) priest I spoke with, who gave me much of his time and much information to ponder and peruse, so did you ... you made me want to dig deeper ... so I am, and, I thank you for that! Basically, you introduced me to TOC.

Please answer this; were at any time, were the names ROCA and ROCOR one of the exact same?
They both refer to the same church being outside of Russia yet my understanding is that there was only one assembly of Russian Orthodox created at that terrible time in Russian history who left the country.

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Barbara
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Re: My Russian Orthodox dilemma

Post by Barbara »

Applause for Fr Mark's excellent summary. It's so clear that a child could grasp it !

Hope you are doing well in your search, Sinok.
Watch out for spies along the way, though !

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