RTOC to glorify Br. Jose and Abp. Averky of Jordanville

[joasia]

Inco,

The reason I said you are ignorant is because you write before you research and you ask questions in such a vulgar fashion. You don't ask questions in innocents of the heart; you ask and then bulldoze more ignorant responses as if you know what you're talking about.

I'm not mean-hearted. I'm straight-forward. You label it as such because you feel the sting. And yet, you still have no idea about the significance of Br. Jose's life. No doubt you have asked who Fr. Seraphim Rose is and probably still don't know.

And yet, you post your views on what the ROCOR people and hierarchy are doing and judging them with the same level of ignorance.

At your level, you have no place to make any assessments. But, you don't understand that, do you? Because you never assessed yourself, in front of God. You just want to point fingers.

Such ignorance. Do your homework.

[Constantine]

At your level, you have no place to make any assessments. But, you don't understand that, do you? Because you never assessed yourself, in front of God. You just want to point fingers.

Such ignorance. Do your homework.

Well if we take the word ignorance and change it a little and add a couple letters, you get the word arrogance, perhaps you should research this word Joasia. You ask Incognito to assess himself, but you without even meeting him or knowing his circumstances judge his heart, and the intentions of his questions. What if Incognito is a 16 year old kid who doesnt know how to phrase a question properly but is going through a tough time and needs help, what if he is a 85 year old immigrant who speaks english but see's the way he asks questions as normal because that is the way he talked all his life, there are 100's of other examples of who or what his circumstances can be which you, I, and everyone else dont know. Some of his points are also very good as well, we call ourselves Orthodox but because someone is ASKING in a way WE dont like we get upset with him, are we illumined teachers, and spiritual guides? Jehovahs Witness, who are workers of the evil one go door to door spreading their lies, people answer the door scream, swear, and insult them, and they sit their with a smile on their face not saying a word and then calmly explain their views, if these jehovahs witness who are workers of the evil one act like this and show this patience and humilty, what should WE who are Orthodox be doing? Let us not become a second jewish race that screams "we have Abraham as our Father"..... we are Orthodox so lets talk down to people? This person is in a intense spiritual battle and asking for help, it is your problem if you are judging the way he is asking, he/she has also asked forgiveness of his sins on every post, but I am sure everyone didnt notice that. How you judge is how you will be judged.

[Incognito1583]

Inco,
You don't ask questions in innocents of the heart;

How do you know? Are you clairvoyant? Now you are judging me.

you ask and then bulldoze more ignorant responses as if you know what you're talking about.

Demonstrate my ignorance. I would love to see this. I admit I never heard of Jose.

I'm not mean-hearted.

What ever happend to blaming onesself? Do you justify yourself in confession too?

I'm straight-forward.

False dichotomy. They are the same thing with you.

No doubt you have asked who Fr. Seraphim Rose is and probably still don't know.

Really? Can you show me thread and post? I know very well who Father Seraphim is. I have read his books and read "Father Seraphim Rose: His Life and Works," two times, and "Not of this World", once. Remember Joasia, lying is a sin even for Orthodox.

And yet, you post your views on what the ROCOR people and hierarchy are doing and judging them with the same level of ignorance.

It's precisely because I am not ignorant that I judge them. It is a fact they are totally divided. It does not take an expert to know this.

You never offer any advice or help. All you do is attack. As I said before, you need A LOT of work. But who doesn't? We are all sinners. I apologize to you Joasia if I have ever sinned against you in word, deed or thought.

[Sean]

For the record, Br. Jose was kept in a very poor state of refrigeration, if any at all, when his body was transported from Greece to the U.S. fourteen days later, yet his body was completely incorrupt at his funeral, when it should have shown signs of decomposition. When Hieromonk Averky (memory eternal) and Reader Dan Olsen did a pannikhida for Br. Jose at his grave, the frigid winds were so active that it was impossible for them to keep candles lit, but then in the midst of it all, the extinguished candles that they placed on Br. Jose's grave miraculously lit on their own. When Br. Jose visited the ROCOR parish in House Springs, MO. in the late 80's, a Serbian layman who lived as a worker at the monastic Hermitage there said that not only did the icon of the Theotokos gush myrrh, but so did Br. Jose. This man told me that Br. Jose had myrrh running off his feet and filling his shoes when he took them off. Br. Jose had a nine hour prayer rule which he recited daily and he was a secret monk. It was not til after his death that it was discovered that he was tonsured to the Great Schema on Mt. Athos.There are many other miracles that I unfortunately do not know about, but the accounts are available.

[Cyprian]

Vl. Stephan is coming to Montreal this weekend. I look forward to talking with him.

Greetings Joasia,

Belated best wishes on your name's day which I believe was a couple weeks ago. I hope it was special for you.

Perhaps you could do us a favor and ask his grace Bp. Stefan if the RTOC has any plans to officially condemn the heresy of Kyprianism at the upcoming Sobor this October.

ROCiE (i.e. ROCOR-V) officially rejected this heresy at the end of 2001.
ROAC officially condemned it at the Sobor held earlier this year.

I am hopeful that RTOC will do the same. The synod hasn't exactly been clear or forthright on this issue over the years.

It's good that he's moving towards a union with Bp. Paul,

I presume you are referring here to Met. Pavlos of Astoria? How is it that you know there is movement towards a union? I know the synod in Greece is supposedly sending a couple of observers and a translator to the RTOC sobor in October. Aside from this, what evidence is there that a union is in the works? Thank you.

not that they have any differences - oh no. They are not pretensious. They care about preserving the Orthodox truth.

I hope I am wrong and Met. Pavlos and his vicar Bp. Christodoulos truly do care about preserving the Orthodox truth. Sad to say, the more I learn about the Astoria group, the less convinced I am that this is so.

Cyprian

[Incognito1583]

There is more wrong with Etna then Kyprianism. The people in Etna are monsters. They strain at a gnat but swallow a camel. They are super-correct, but have absolutely no comprehension of love and humility. In fact, they are the worst people I have ever known in my entire Orthodox experience.

As for Father Seraphim Rose, I first heard about him in about 1988 and learned about him more in 1991. I never asked who he was. But like Etna, I believe Joasia lies and believes in the delusion of "blessed" lying and sinning. Some modern clergy give obediences to people to lie, sin and slander. They think they are above God's moral and ethical laws. The real problem plaguing Orthodoxy today is not canonicity, but the complete obliteration of the virtues.

Joasia, you have no love or humility. And I would even say that you argue with your priest and justify yourself in confession. That's all I have to say.

I apologize for my sins.

[Incognito1583]

And the reason the churches are the way they are today is because there is no love, no humility, no obedience, no patience and no commitment. As I said, the real problem is the obliteration of the virtues. The canonicity problem is the logical end result of this.