Good Works of Ecumenists and Heterodox Gain Nothing

[Matthew]

Saint Theodore the Studite writes some things that are very good to remember. We behold the Protestants and other zealous and very well-intentioned heterodox racing all over the world translating the New Testament for everyone to read, bringing medical supplies, building schools and orphanages, and doing many good works of mercy. All very laudable, and I have little doubt that there is a huge amount of genuine love and compassion for humanity there, and also a real solid, natural desire to please the Holy Trinity there. However, St Theodore warns us with the Voice of the Spirit of Truth, that such works do not SAVE us if we are heretics, or in communion with those heretics. It sounds barbaric to our modern sensibilities, but this is simply the case. We MUST be ORTHODOX if we would be saved. Doctrine really does matter, no matter what popular opinion is today--even among traditionally minded and "Bible-defending" Christians. Deviant, unOrthodox doctrines make us ENEMIES of Christ, no matter how sincere and energetic our efforts to be True Christians are. Period.

“Even if one should give away all his possessions in the world, and yet be in communion with heresy, he cannot be a friend of God, but is rather an enemy.”

St. Theodore the Studite
(PG 99, 1205)

“Chrysostomos loudly declares not only heretics, but also those who have communion with them, to be enemies of God.”

St. Theodore the Studite
[ Epistle to Abbot Theophilus ]

“Guard yourselves from soul-destroying heresy, communion with which is alienation from Christ.”

St. Theodore the Studite
[P.G. 99.1216.]

“The heretics were totally shipwrecked with regard to the Faith; but as for the others, even if in their thinking they did not founder, nevertheless, because of their communion with heresy they are perishing.”

St. Theodore the Studite
[Patrologia Graeca 99, 1164]

[jgress]

Right. In general, of course, good works not done for Christ's sake are useless for salvation. Today's lesson about the Publican and Pharisee should teach us this! We need true humility to accept the truth, which is that the only good comes through Christ and must be attributed to Christ.

[ANGELA]

Sorry, you are not right when you say this. Let God be the judge of this, not you.

God will see the heart, regardless of what faith people have and not because you are old calendarists, that you all will be saved. Only God knows this not anyone else.

Like I have said before, I do not usually like to reply, to any topics as this forum, seems to me has become only for the old calender people.

But please, if you want new people to look into this forum, be respectful that we are not all old calendar followers.

Jonathan, perhaps you should add in this forum, that it only belongs to the old calender beleivers and no one else.

[jgress]

I think you make a fair point, Angela. God alone knows our hearts, and somehow good done by those even outside the Church can "count". I think maybe what Icxypion is getting at is the arguments that I have sometimes heard from World Orthodox apologists that because the official churches are doing much objective good, that somehow "proves" that they are right and that the True Orthodox are wrong. It's not a logical argument, because firstly, as St Theodore the Studite explained, you need to have the right faith, and be in communion with those of the right faith, in addition to all those other good things (feeding the poor, etc.). Secondly, many in the True Orthodox Church also do good things of this kind, so by the new calendarist argument that should also "prove" that we are right.

But yes, this is a True Orthodox forum, and has been for a long time now, so it's understood that this is the "position" of the forum. You don't have to be True Orthodox to be a member, just don't use it as a platform for denouncing the True Orthodox.

[ANGELA]

Thank you Jonathan for your reply.

I dont use this forum for anything, other than learning more about our Orthodox Faith. Whether your Old Canderist or New Calenderist, thats okay.

When I first came here, I thought True Orthodox meant Orthodox, but I have come to realise its actually something else.

We are all working for the salvation of our souls, and through the prayers of our Most Holy Theotokos, and our Saints and Angels, may we finish the good race victorious.

I believe we are put on this planet to help others as much as we are able. That should be our focus, and to try to live simply, pleasing in Gods eyes.

Angela

[Maria]

I think you make a fair point, Angela. God alone knows our hearts, and somehow good done by those even outside the Church can "count". I think maybe what Icxypion is getting at is the arguments that I have sometimes heard from World Orthodox apologists that because the official churches are doing much objective good, that somehow "proves" that they are right and that the True Orthodox are wrong. It's not a logical argument, because firstly, as St Theodore the Studite explained, you need to have the right faith, and be in communion with those of the right faith, in addition to all those other good things (feeding the poor, etc.). Secondly, many in the True Orthodox Church also do good things of this kind, so by the new calendarist argument that should also "prove" that we are right.

But yes, this is a True Orthodox forum, and has been for a long time now, so it's understood that this is the "position" of the forum. You don't have to be True Orthodox to be a member, just don't use it as a platform for denouncing the True Orthodox.

Angela,

I just wanted to add that while I was an inquirer into True Orthodoxy before my Holy Baptism, I frequented this forum, and found it to be a safe haven. However, in New Calendarist forums, I came under attack and was frequently called a schismatic, heretic, or one of those radical fundamentalists.

I thank God for this forum. We need a place were we can discuss the Epistles of St. Paul urging us to cover our heads without being told that we are proud, stiff-necked, and consider ourselves to be "holier than thou".

I know, love, and respect many New Calendarists who are priests and laity. Do I think they are on a path of damnation? No.
However, I am praying for them that they may be saved. We all need to pray for each other that we may be saved.

[ANGELA]

Yes, thank you Maria, may God have mercy on us all