Evolution and an Orthodox Patristic understanding of Genesis

[Constantine]

Dear Pravoslavnik, these facts you post are quite nice, BUT, are you aware that the theory of evolution was proposed in the early 19th century. By people that were trying to disprove the existence of God, this is the origin/purpose of the evolutionary theory,-to disprove the existance of God. All those that try to apply evolution to Orthodoxy, are just taking a perverted teaching and perverting it more.

Tell me, were any of the Saints or Fathers teaching evolution? Or did it take the teaching of a man that didnt even believe in God to complete the teachings of the Fathers?

Orthodoxy cleary says God created man in his image, and breathed into his mouth and gave him life.

Evolution says we came from monkeys.

I pick the Orthodox version.

Please stop trying to mix world knowledge, with the Orthodox faith,the faith given to people by God.

Constantine

[ChristosVoskrese]

Pravo,

All these so-called "hominids" that you refer to have either been proven to be all ape (Lucy, Homo Habilis, Homo Erectus), all man (Neanderthals) or fake (Piltdown "Man", Nebraska "Man"). Not to mention that the "evidence" usually often consists of just a couple of bones. For example, Homo Erectus/Java "Man" was reconstructed from just a thigh bone, a skullcap and three teeth. The skull-cap and the leg-bone were about 50 feet apart.

Also, these bones cannot tell us what these so-called "ape-men" looked like. You cannot tell how much body hair the owner of the bones had simply from looking at the bones. The drawings you see of "ape-men" are based more on imagination than on evidence. Artists must create something between an ape and a human being; the older it is said to be, the more apelike they make it. Fossil hunter Donald Johnson acknowledged: "No-one can be sure just what any extinct hominid looked like".

These drawing of ape-men are nothing more than fantasy.

[joasia]

Basically, Christ showed that death is a temporary circumstance. We have to get through the earthly events that will lead to the end of this world. And then there will be no more death.

To those "Orthodox" people who believe in evolution...when did the soul come into existence? Because you "Orthodox" do realize that the evolutionists are atheists, don't you?

[stumbler]

Because how a person evaluates science determines their religious beliefs? Are there particular restaurants that demonstrate true Orthodoxy better than others too? Aparticular model of car or truck for believers and one for non-believers?

[ChristosVoskrese]

This is a challenge to Pravoslavnik, stumbler and all those who think that evolution and Orthodoxy can be combined.

I just want answers to my questions - I don't want you posting any other information or changing the topic. Just answer the questions.

1. At what point during the evolutionary process was the soul created?

2. The Holy Scriptures state: "Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin" (Romans 5:12). This is quite clear: by Adam's sin, death entered the world. Man brought death into the world. Evolution says that death brought man into the world. These are two opposing views. Which one do you believe?

3. Our Lord Jesus Christ said "But from the beginning of the creation, God made them [Adam and Eve] male and female" (Mark 10:6) Jesus said that Adam and Eve were created at the beginning, not millions of years after the beginning, like evolution says.
   There are three possible explanations for this.
   (a) Was Jesus lying?
   (b) Did Jesus not understand modern science?
   (c) Was Jesus right?

Now, if you choose (a) or (b), then you are immediately denying the divinity of Christ. If Christ is God, then He knows everything and He cannot lie. The only possible answer is (c) - and that means that evolution cannot possibly be true.

[TomS]

3. Our Lord Jesus Christ said "But from the beginning of the creation, God made them [Adam and Eve] male and female" (Mark 10:6) Jesus said that Adam and Eve were created at the beginning, not millions of years after the beginning, like evolution says.
There are three possible explanations for this.
(a) Was Jesus lying?
(b) Did Jesus not understand modern science?
(c) Was Jesus right?

But God did not create man "at the beginning". According to scripture, He created him on the 6th day. The 6th day is not "the beginning"; it is AFTER the beginning.

You are totally MISSING the point of all the posts. Can't you people understand simple english????

You traditionalists are so inconsistent. When it suits you, you all throw up the idea that God work OUTSIDE of time. Yet when it DOES not suit your argument, you insist that God must work WITHIN time.

The point being made (consistently, I might add) is that God is NOT constrained by 24 hour days!! Something which is VERY CONSISTENT with the Orthodox understanding of God.

[Anastasios]

Basically, Christ showed that death is a temporary circumstance. We have to get through the earthly events that will lead to the end of this world. And then there will be no more death.

To those "Orthodox" people who believe in evolution...when did the soul come into existence? Because you "Orthodox" do realize that the evolutionists are atheists, don't you?

I am not interested in this debate one way or the other as I simply believe God created the world and mankind, but I do object to simplistic arguments in discussions.

One could say that God decided at the right time to endow the human with a rational soul. And to say "you do realize that evolutionists are atheists, don't you?" is a bit of an overgeneralization. You do realize that people actually have serious debates on this subject beyond a simple dismissal of the topic, and that when one is overly dismissive, one turns off the ears of others? It's better to provide a reasoned response, not one that is dismissive.