I blew up the Discord/Requiem for the Server

[Priest Antonios]

@Rumpelstiltskin - that's good news! Now we'll need a thread for your YouTube video announcements here. Assuming you're going to continue doing them?

[Suaidan]

... I could create that

[Suaidan]

For reference, this is in continuation of another thread where somehow a secondary topic became my destruction of the NFTU server. I'm answering here to keep everything topic appropriate.

Regarding Discord:
With all due respect Father, you deleted your NFTU Discord server overnight without giving an explanation or warning to anyone. This left everyone confused and downcast. If you don’t like Discord, you still could have handed off the server to someone else.

I did, and I have not only created a thread about it, I did a YT video about it.

If my advice is worth anything, consider not phrasing in universals. Doing so creates illusions about how people think and works in an imaginary binary ("everyone/no one".) I would argue that the platform of Discord itself amplifies and is intentionally designed to encourage "groupthink" or "mobthink". This is a problem that stared me in the face too obviously as I deleted the server. But let's be clear: I believe that server reached 150 people at its height and I'm being generous. There was no "everyone" because it wasn't that many people. There are True Orthodox parishes (in the US!) which have more attendees on a good Sunday than that entire server. So having pointed out the false binary, let's address the rest of the post.

This is in hindsight and no one holds a grudge about it, but no one really understood this decision. You have the right to use whatever platforms you wish, but your decision disappointed many people. The NFTU server was still growing with the recent spike in True Orthodox inquirers. It was many people’s only line to talk to True Orthodox people.

Now it's time for me to ask you a question. If you realize something is fundamentally "broken" (or realize is broken by design) and have alternate-- if imperfect-- resources to use to keep people in communication, do you wait for group to grow from say 150 to 200? Of course not. Do you issue a warning, perhaps to slowly precipitate what happened anyway (like the creation of a half dozen alternate servers that don't operate the same way, because people often have different overriding agendas)? What's the point of that? Finally, the most important question: if you know where most of your inflow of new interest is coming from (YouTube) do you then push people into a system where they can be further controlled by people with different outside agendas on another controlled network? Or do you build your own network? As I had already been working on restoring the cafe for months, the answer to me seemed rather obvious.

Everyone on there had a big shock when it vanished. All the work put into the server by many people volunteering their free time vanished with it.

Believe it or not, this tied into my decision. Some people volunteering did things that made other people volunteering angry. There was near-constant infighting in one way or another-- if not in the mod queue, on DMs-- and every other conflict felt like an existential risk for the server. It was draining and frankly I felt worse every day because of it.

Father, are we supposed to unilaterally condemn a platform because some immoral persons own or created it? If that is the case, we shouldn’t use Telegram, Facebook, YouTube, Google, Gmail, or X (Twitter) etc.

I have my issues with each of these platforms. However, maintaining a decentralized and visible presence means doing so with care. Up until last year's Crucible debate, for the most part, all I used was YouTube, Odysee, and Gab. However, that's not quite my problem with Discord. I've mentioned this in the past on the matter, and my real problem with Discord is hyperfocus on addictive design and systemic encouragement of groupthink. All the other platforms care about their design, but not as slickly as Discord. It was one of the realizations that started to make me concerned. All of a sudden it was "if you're interested in what we're discussing on YT, join our Discord." And when I realized it was repetitively this theme, I woke up for a moment and thought "wait, why am I advertising a proprietary platform run by people who openly and obviously hate us?"

For example, everyone can look up who Elon Musk is and how he’s involved with the occult. It doesn’t mean that using Twitter is a sin or we should look down on people using it.

The man went from Baphomet man two years ago to crusading against liberalism and calling himself a cultural Christian now. Perhaps his story arc isn't over. But are you making a reference to my usage of the platform?

The same thing applies to Discord or Facebook. Discord is popular because it has many functions like voice calls that chat sites like this don’t have.

Ok, I get the need to add voice chats down the line, etc. But none of its features are missing on, say, FB, but the youth demographic isn't rushing off to FB: a lot of them are on Discord, and kids are especially vulnerable to groupthink. So what young people see as a feature is actually a predatory tactic on the part of company leadership.

The interface is also much easier to use on a phone.

Only if you're already used to Discord and are familiar with the icons and design setup. Discord on a phone to someone who isn't already Discord-addicted is actually quite confusing.

Likewise there’s a reason why people use YouTube. It’s because when channels go fully alt media they lose at least 75% of their audience. I support alt media but it’s an uphill battle for them to gain the reach of bigger platforms.

As someone who deleted my personal Twitter account around four years ago because of the clampdowns, I'm in complete disagreement. For me, my Gab account and my personal blog were-- and are-- a way to ensure that there was at least corners of the internet where I couldn't be deleted. I didn't see it in terms of gaining "maximum exposure" -- I was concerned about being deplatformed and my voice being removed from the Internet (really, the clearnet) altogether. It was the fact that I had an antifragile background already (NFTU is 20 years old this year, which means it has a deeper web history than most social media sites) that meant that all I personally had to do was toughen up and take a harder stance for four years.

There are some very logical reasons why people use big platforms, and it isn’t because of blue haired communists. There are just as many blue haired communists on Facebook, which you use Fr.. On Facebook, there’s also a lot of scammers and bots harassing people.

Yes, I use Facebook. In fact, I despise it. It's why I only have 100 friends there-- it was meant to only be my family and local/direct Church contacts. That was it. Thanks to Discord I got a bunch more friend requests, meaning more people could see my personal business and get offended if I didn't let them. Some days I seriously consider deleting my FB account, which I've had for about 15 years. Writing this post may lead me to do that.

I use both, but Discord has some advantages certainly. I’m not trying to convince anyone to use Discord

I mean, you kinda are

- but what are the reasons for your very negative assessment of Discord all of a sudden?

It isn't sudden at all. I've been open about it for months. Look at this thread's predecessor posts.

With all due respect Father, your comments come across as an attack on your old NFTU server audience - even if that’s not what you intended.

My audience of less than 150, and I still keep in touch with the formerly most active posters? Let's be honest: the server's most active posters were-- and often still are-- active on my YT channel. They're active here. (I had been inviting them here from the Discord for almost a month.) They're active on Telegram, where I don't have an account. Some are active on X, where I do have an account. Some are active on Gab. And some are active on YT. Some email me and some even call me. That's the power of antifragility vs app addiction.

I am open to any correction or criticism regarding this, and I don’t intend this comment in any hostile way whatsoever.

No offense taken. Please consider what I said. God bless you.

[Bruder Klaus]

Who is addicted to Discord? I think, alot of guys need this kind of community, because they have neither parish close to them nor orthodox faithful. Sadly, for the time being, there is no alternative to Discord. If we find one, good. When I found Telegram a few years ago, I was glad that I could drop Discord at that point. We'll see what we can find now in 2024.

[Suaidan]

Who is addicted to Discord? I think, alot of guys need this kind of community, because they have neither parish close to them nor orthodox faithful. Sadly, for the time being, there is no alternative to Discord. If we find one, good. When I found Telegram a few years ago, I was glad that I could drop Discord at that point. We'll see what we can find now in 2024.

Hopefully we can find someplace where True Orthodox Christians can chat, message, post, and share documents in 2024

[SavaBeljovic]

Who is addicted to Discord? I think, alot of guys need this kind of community, because they have neither parish close to them nor orthodox faithful. Sadly, for the time being, there is no alternative to Discord. If we find one, good. When I found Telegram a few years ago, I was glad that I could drop Discord at that point. We'll see what we can find now in 2024.

Hopefully we can find someplace where True Orthodox Christians can chat, message, post, and share documents in 2024

Myspace

[Suaidan]

Hopefully we can find someplace where True Orthodox Christians can chat, message, post, and share documents in 2024

Myspace

pour one out for Tom

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