The Western Rite, Saint John of SF, and ROCOR

joasia · Post by **joasia** » Mon 14 May 2007 5:13 pm

CHRIST IS RISEN!

James, can you give a summary of how the western rites believers live? You left them to come to Orthodox; that is very significant. What are their views that made you start questioning it? Were you born in it or was it a conversion?

In Christ, Joanna

james cooper · Post by **james cooper** » Tue 15 May 2007 3:28 pm

joanna i was brought up in the church of england which i left in 1995 there was many reasons for this bishops not beliveing in the virgin birth of christ . the holy trinty and many other things which i had been brought up to belive in there was all so woman priests homosexual christian rites homosexual priests and the thing that made up my mind was a picture of christ on a cross as a woman i thank god the orthodox church which i enterd in 2000 has shown me the true picture of christ, and for the gift of the holy spirit .
hope this is of some use to you

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                   yours in christ
              james a sinner

The Apostate · Post by **The Apostate** » Fri 18 May 2007 8:02 pm

james cooper wrote:
im a convert to the orthodox church i left these western rites behide and any one wanting to become orthodox should embrace
the eastern rites as i have
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          yours in christ
             james
           a sinner[/quote]
I have sympathy with part of the sentiment you express, James, but on the other hand, it reads to me as "All converts should follow my example", and, if you'll forgive my saying so, I'm not sure that sits very comfortably with me.

joasia · Post by **joasia** » Fri 18 May 2007 10:46 pm

Oh. Let him be, Michael. He sounds like he is zealous in his faith. He needs that now. I just finished posting to a man who believes that we evolved from a rock.

Figure it out. Who needs more guidance?

In Christ,

Joanna

The Apostate · Post by **The Apostate** » Sun 20 May 2007 1:35 pm

Fair enough.

james cooper · Post by **james cooper** » Sun 20 May 2007 2:45 pm

hi michael sorry if i gve you the impression that all converts do as i do that is wrong they should do what christ wants them to do but i am truly against western rite use in the orthodox church as you will see on other pages many have joined and left for many reasons i see you quote saint mark of ephesus as he himself was against many western innovations that made me smile thanks hope i have not caused you any offence
yours in christ
james a sinner

joasia · Post by **joasia** » Sun 20 May 2007 3:46 pm

It IS imperative that order is kept in the Orthodox Church. Innovations of the West should not be used in Orthodox services.

It took some time for me to get used to choirs in the Russian Church and with women. I started in the Greek Church and heard the men cantors. Choirs are a Western influence, but it is not detrimental to the Holy Services.

I was very zealous too. It's only natural that we place importance on the way things are done, because we need to learn new ways which are Orthodox. And it's natural that we would want to see the strict Orthodox ways in others since we learnt alot of them from reading the saints. But, in time, God guides us to look inwardly. We shouldn't neglect the outward, but we should remember that we are sinners and nothing is done that is right by God. If we did, we'd all be glowing like the saints.

All converts are required to put away the old man and the religion they were involved in. So yes, all converts should reject what they followed and embrace the Eastern rites. That's why we are required to blow to the West, three times in the catechumen service. It's a sign of our rejection of what we used to be.

In Christ, Joanna