Cyprian wrote:Of course everyone is well aware that the holy confessor Met. Philaret of NY and the synod he presided over withdrew from communion with the new calendarist schismatics, ...
Can you please provide a document signed by the members of the ROCOR synod which states they have broken communion with the "new calendar schismatics"? (Or even, that they have broken communion with anyone at all.)
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Priest Mark Smith
British Columbia
Can you please provide a document signed by the members of the ROCOR synod which states they have broken communion with the "new calendar schismatics"? (Or even, that they have broken communion with anyone at all.)
Greetings father.
I wasn't aware that formal documents were needed. Are there formal documents signed by the Holy Synod of the GOC of Greece severing communion with all the local churches of so-called "World Orthodoxy"? I would be interested to see them, if they exist.
Everyone recognizes that the ROCOR under the presidency of Met. Philaret shied away from concelebrations with the new calendarists in the mid to late sixties subsequent to the "lifting" of the anathemas by Athenagoras.
Met. Philaret began receiving clergy from apostate world orthodoxy without canonical transfers.
And let's not forget the following excerpt from:
"The Dubious Orthodoxy of Metropolitan Cyprian's Group"
by Bishop GREGORY [Grabbe]
(Translated from Church News [in Russian], No. 5, Sept. - Oct. 1994, pp. 2-4.)
"Our previous Bishops' Sobors never raised the particular question concerning whether or not the New Calendarists have Grace. But the fact that formerly concelebrations with them were never permitted already testifies with sufficient clarity that the Church Abroad considered them to be without Grace."
So his grace Bishop Gregory testifies that concelebrations with the new calendarists were not permitted and the ROCOR considered them without grace.
Cyprian
Cyprian wrote:I wasn't aware that formal documents were needed. Are there formal documents signed by the Holy Synod of the GOC of Greece severing communion with all the local churches of so-called "World Orthodoxy"? I would be interested to see them, if they exist.
From the Encyclical of 1935:
On account of this, we counsel all who follow the Orthodox festal calendar to have no spiritual communion with the schismatic Church and its schismatic ministers, from whom the grace of the All-holy Spirit has departed, since they have set at nought the resolutions of the Fathers of the Seven Ecumenical Councils and the Pan-Orthodox Councils that condemned the Gregorian festal calendar.
From the Act of 1957:
We denounce the “official” [church] as innovationist, as schismatic, as cacodox, paving directly towards heresy.
We have no communion with the cacodox “official” [church], not recognizing the validity of its mysteries, not considering its acts and condemnations against us to have any authority.
In 1974 ROCOR wrote to the GOC synod : "Concerning the matter relative to the presence or the non-existence of God's Grace among the followers of the New Calendar, the Russian Church outside of Russia do not consider themselves or any other local Church having the authority to take final decision, as a final settlement of this matter can only be effected through a properly convened competent Oecumenical Council, with the indespensible participation of a free Church of Russia."
Part of the response from the GOC was: "The Church of the Genuine Orthodox Christians of Greece has no spiritual communication or canonical relations with churches using the Old Calendar (Jerusalem, Serbia, Russia, etc.) but communicate with a Church which follows the New Calendar Innovation, and this because according to St. John Chrysostomos 'he who communicates with the uncommunicable is excommunicated'." The GOC synod then "interrupted" any further relations with ROCOR until the "probable revision" of their "Credo".
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Priest Mark Smith
British Columbia
From the Encyclical of 1935:
On account of this, we counsel all who follow the Orthodox festal calendar to have no spiritual communion with the schismatic Church and its schismatic ministers, from whom the grace of the All-holy Spirit has departed, since they have set at nought the resolutions of the Fathers of the Seven Ecumenical Councils and the Pan-Orthodox Councils that condemned the Gregorian festal calendar.
But of course this "schismatic Church" would not apply to say, the Serbians and the Russians, for example, who continued using the true Patristic calendar, rejecting the new calendar innovation.
From the Act of 1957:
We denounce the “official” [church] as innovationist, as schismatic, as cacodox, paving directly towards heresy.
We have no communion with the cacodox “official” [church], not recognizing the validity of its mysteries, not considering its acts and condemnations against us to have any authority.
Yes, but this so-called '"official" [church]' is not explicitly defined -- at least not in the brief excerpt which you provided.
Part of the response from the GOC was: "The Church of the Genuine Orthodox Christians of Greece has no spiritual communication or canonical relations with churches using the Old Calendar (Jerusalem, Serbia, Russia, etc.) but communicate with a Church which follows the New Calendar Innovation, and this because according to St. John Chrysostomos 'he who communicates with the uncommunicable is excommunicated'." The GOC synod then "interrupted" any further relations with ROCOR until the "probable revision" of their "Credo".
Now this statement is much more explicit, but this was not until in 1974. Are you able to provide any kind of official documentation signed by the GOC bishops proclaiming their abstention from communion with local churches such as the Serbian and Jerusalem patriarchate, prior to 1974? If not, then how is this any different than the situation with the ROCA?
I presume that you would not maintain that the GOC of Greece was in communion with the Serbians and Russians and Jerusalem all the way up until 1974? So where are the documents, signed by the bishops, officially stating this reality?
Please provide a document from prior to 1974, demonstrating that the GOC of Greece officially severed communion from those local churches which did not accept the calendar innovation.
Thank you, father.
Cyprian
You could have followed the link and read the rest of the epistle of 1976.
I have shown you what I have in English so far, what do you have?
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Priest Mark Smith
British Columbia
Dear Cyprian, I hope all is well with you. You have stated several times and passionatly I may add 
That there is no such thing as a russian orthodox church or greek orthodox church or serbian orthodox church, and that the church is universal. Please correct me if I am wrong. The Church of Greece, the EP, MP, SP, JP are all the same church, in there minds the Orthodox Church. Our creed says 1 church, and all these administration points, are in there minds, that church, and that ecclesiologically is correct. To say there is sick members of a church is kyprianite. This is just my opinion. Also at the very least there is a document from 1976 from the GOC, let us not get side tracked, is there 1 document from rocors beginning until today stating anything about breaking communion with anyone?
