Marrying a non Christian

[KOSTACC]

What is the penalty if a Orthodox Christian marries outside the Church to a non Christian ?
I have heard it is excommunication of all the Church's Mysteries for life, or at least until your dying on your deathbed, is this correct ? What if the couple divorced, would the Orthodox one be re-communicated? What if the couple had a child, could that child be baptized if the non Christian parent objected ?

[jgress]

What is the penalty if a Orthodox Christian marries outside the Church to a non Christian ?
I have heard it is excommunication of all the Church's Mysteries for life, or at least until your dying on your deathbed, is this correct ? What if the couple divorced, would the Orthodox one be re-communicated? What if the couple had a child, could that child be baptized if the non Christian parent objected ?

On monachos.net, there was a similar thread, and Fr David Moser of ROCOR said the usual penalty was denial of Communion until either the non-Orthodox spouse converted and they could be married in Church or until they agreed to live as brother and sister. I presume if they later divorced that would also allow the Orthodox spouse to receive Communion again.

I'm not sure the Church would require the consent of the non-Orthodox spouse to baptize their child, though I can see it being a bad idea from the point of view of the stability of the marriage to go through with it with their consent. Of course, that's just one reason why it's a bad idea to marry outside the Church!

[KOSTACC]

What is the penalty if a Orthodox Christian marries outside the Church to a non Christian ?
I have heard it is excommunication of all the Church's Mysteries for life, or at least until your dying on your deathbed, is this correct ? What if the couple divorced, would the Orthodox one be re-communicated? What if the couple had a child, could that child be baptized if the non Christian parent objected ?

On monachos.net, there was a similar thread, and Fr David Moser of ROCOR said the usual penalty was denial of Communion until either the non-Orthodox spouse converted and they could be married in Church or until they agreed to live as brother and sister. I presume if they later divorced that would also allow the Orthodox spouse to receive Communion again.

I'm not sure the Church would require the consent of the non-Orthodox spouse to baptize their child, though I can see it being a bad idea from the point of view of the stability of the marriage to go through with it with their consent. Of course, that's just one reason why it's a bad idea to marry outside the Church!

I would assume also that the person would not be permitted to take Confession and receive forgiveness of sins by a priest, could not receive Holy Unction, nor be allowed to vote or hold a position on a church parish council. Beside these, I would assume that if that person were say, a ordained reader he would be stripped of that title. Could the person be allowed to chant in a service? I'm not too sure about that one.
Besides all this I would think the person would not be allowed to teach Orthodoxy, be it in an Orthodox seminary school (save perhaps a World Orthodox type seminary) or on any public forum, publicly or privately to anyone outside their immediate family.
I can understand how two people of different faiths could meet and fall in love, especially in a traditionally non Orthodox country. I suppose if they had their minds set on getting married, no matter what, it would be better to do so without the other person converting, just for the sake of the other, without really being serious about it. However, I think that if the Orthodox person believed that the other would eventually sincerely convert later somewhere down the line, that odds are, it probably would never happen.

[jgress]

On monachos.net, there was a similar thread, and Fr David Moser of ROCOR said the usual penalty was denial of Communion until either the non-Orthodox spouse converted and they could be married in Church or until they agreed to live as brother and sister. I presume if they later divorced that would also allow the Orthodox spouse to receive Communion again.

I'm not sure the Church would require the consent of the non-Orthodox spouse to baptize their child, though I can see it being a bad idea from the point of view of the stability of the marriage to go through with it with their consent. Of course, that's just one reason why it's a bad idea to marry outside the Church!

I would assume also that the person would not be permitted to take Confession and receive forgiveness of sins by a priest, could not receive Holy Unction, nor be allowed to vote or hold a position on a church parish council. Beside these, I would assume that if that person were say, a ordained reader he would be stripped of that title. Could the person be allowed to chant in a service? I'm not too sure about that one.
Besides all this I would think the person would not be allowed to teach Orthodoxy, be it in an Orthodox seminary school (save perhaps a World Orthodox type seminary) or on any public forum, publicly or privately to anyone outside their immediate family.
I can understand how two people of different faiths could meet and fall in love, especially in a traditionally non Orthodox country. I suppose if they had their minds set on getting married, no matter what, it would be better to do so without the other person converting, just for the sake of the other, without really being serious about it. However, I think that if the Orthodox person believed that the other would eventually sincerely convert later somewhere down the line, that odds are, it probably would never happen.

I don't know about the rest, i.e. being barred from confession and the rest. I suppose it makes sense, since you technically haven't repented of the sin while you are still living with her as wife, so the priest can't read the forgiveness prayer or admit you to other sacraments or quasi-sacraments that normally require absolution beforehand, e.g. Unction, or receiving the water blessed at Theophany. I think it would still be a good idea to confess your others sins to your priest, to continue attending services, saying prayers, fasting etc. I would expect most priests would understand that, if an Orthodox person falls into this sin and marries outside the Church, he may not then be in a position to leave her and resume full participation in Church life, so some kind of half-way participation would be necessary in order for him not to abandon the Faith.

But really you'd need to speak to your priest about this.

[KOSTACC]

On monachos.net, there was a similar thread, and Fr David Moser of ROCOR said the usual penalty was denial of Communion until either the non-Orthodox spouse converted and they could be married in Church or until they agreed to live as brother and sister. I presume if they later divorced that would also allow the Orthodox spouse to receive Communion again.

I'm not sure the Church would require the consent of the non-Orthodox spouse to baptize their child, though I can see it being a bad idea from the point of view of the stability of the marriage to go through with it with their consent. Of course, that's just one reason why it's a bad idea to marry outside the Church!

I would assume also that the person would not be permitted to take Confession and receive forgiveness of sins by a priest, could not receive Holy Unction, nor be allowed to vote or hold a position on a church parish council. Beside these, I would assume that if that person were say, a ordained reader he would be stripped of that title. Could the person be allowed to chant in a service? I'm not too sure about that one.
Besides all this I would think the person would not be allowed to teach Orthodoxy, be it in an Orthodox seminary school (save perhaps a World Orthodox type seminary) or on any public forum, publicly or privately to anyone outside their immediate family.
I can understand how two people of different faiths could meet and fall in love, especially in a traditionally non Orthodox country. I suppose if they had their minds set on getting married, no matter what, it would be better to do so without the other person converting, just for the sake of the other, without really being serious about it. However, I think that if the Orthodox person believed that the other would eventually sincerely convert later somewhere down the line, that odds are, it probably would never happen.

I don't know about the rest, i.e. being barred from confession and the rest. I suppose it makes sense, since you technically haven't repented of the sin while you are still living with her as wife, so the priest can't read the forgiveness prayer or admit you to other sacraments or quasi-sacraments that normally require absolution beforehand, e.g. Unction, or receiving the water blessed at Theophany. I think it would still be a good idea to confess your others sins to your priest, to continue attending services, saying prayers, fasting etc. I would expect most priests would understand that, if an Orthodox person falls into this sin and marries outside the Church, he may not then be in a position to leave her and resume full participation in Church life, so some kind of half-way participation would be necessary in order for him not to abandon the Faith.

But really you'd need to speak to your priest about this. Why are you asking anyway?

I think you are correct, of course. One should continue attending services, saying prayers, fasting etc. if they don't wish to leave the Orthodox Church completely. I would think that it would be OK to confess to a priest, however, Confession is one of the sacraments of the Church so getting granted absolution by the priest I would assume is also out the window along with receiving communion.

I think it's a silly notion to expect the couple to agree to live as brother and sister so that the Orthodox partner may start receiving the Church's Mysteries again if the other is not Orthodox, or even any kind of a Christian, don't you ? How is that suppose to work and that would also depend on their truthfulness to abstain from marital relations, unless the Orthodox partner goes and lives in a monastery.

[Maria]

Prayer, fasting, and attendance at Holy Services is good for both an Orthodox Christian and the non-Christian spouse, as God will respond to the unceasing prayers of a devout believer.

Remember also that the Most Holy Theotokos is always quick to hear those who honor her.

We must not judge others, but pray for all our Orthodox Christians brethren that we all may be saved.

[Maria]

I have edited two posts removing lines of personal questioning and relocated one post into the Mod Archives.

Please avoid asking each other personal questions. If someone wants to volunteer information, let them, but do not pry.

Thank you,
Maria
Administrator