Is Father Seraphim Rose a heretic?

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Justice
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Is Father Seraphim Rose a heretic?

Postby Justice » Thu 28 September 2017 11:44 pm

According to Orthodox Wiki, Father Seraphim Rose thought the Moscow Patriarchate still had valid sacraments and held grace going against the ROCOR. I feel as though he may have had ecumenist since he expressed these heretical beliefs. So this begs the question, how can Father Seraphim Rose be a saint?

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Re: Is Father Seraphim Rose a heretic?

Postby Maria » Fri 29 September 2017 2:50 am

Be careful as Orthodox Wiki is run by a priest in the OCA.

I have two of Father Seraphim Rose's books in the older editions. However, the more recent editions, that are being published by the Serbian Orthodox Church, have been highly edited to remove passages that attack the MP.
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Re: Is Father Seraphim Rose a heretic?

Postby Maria » Fri 29 September 2017 5:08 am

I just received my copy of Russia's Catacomb Saints
written by Andreyev (Part 1), taken from other sources, and then compiled and edited by Father Seraphim Rose.

This book was published shortly after the death of Father Seraphim Rose in a manuscript format.
In it, Father Seraphim shows how the Sergianist MP was corrupted and complicit in the martyrdom of many hierarchs, priests, deacons, monastics, and laity. From this book, one learns how Father Seraphim must have wept at the sheer brutality of the Sergianist MP church.

From reading his writings, I believe that Father Seraphim (Rose) of Platina is most likely a saint.

Strange, not too long before Father Seraphim's death, he was visited by Anthony of Geneva, who was even at that time, coercing and blackmailing bishops, priests, monastics, and laity to consider joining the MP. It was primarily Anthony of Geneva who spearheaded the move of the ROCOR to join the MP. From what I have read of him, I think he was a KGB agent as was most likely Anthony Bloom of the UK. (Incidentally, Vladimir Moss and his wife wrote about Anthony Bloom and a suspicious murder which occurred during one of his pastoral visits.) During the ten years that proceeded the MP-ROCOR union, whenever Anthony of Geneva visited his fellow hierarchs, an argument was witnessed, a death, or a capitulation to the MP occurred. It was just too coincidental.
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Re: Is Father Seraphim Rose a heretic?

Postby Justice » Fri 29 September 2017 1:50 pm

Maria wrote:Be careful as Orthodox Wiki is run by a priest in the OCA.

I have two of Father Seraphim Rose's books in the older editions. However, the more recent editions, that are being published by the Serbian Orthodox Church, have been highly edited to remove passages that attack the MP.

I didn't know this, thank you for telling me.

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Re: Is Father Seraphim Rose a heretic?

Postby Justice » Fri 29 September 2017 1:53 pm

Maria wrote:I just received my copy of Russia's Catacomb Saints
written by Andreyev (Part 1), taken from other sources, and then compiled and edited by Father Seraphim Rose.

This book was published shortly after the death of Father Seraphim Rose in a manuscript format.
In it, Father Seraphim shows how the Sergianist MP was corrupted and complicit in the martyrdom of many hierarchs, priests, deacons, monastics, and laity. From this book, one learns how Father Seraphim must have wept at the sheer brutality of the Sergianist MP church.

From reading his writings, I believe that Father Seraphim (Rose) of Platina is most likely a saint.

Strange, not too long before Father Seraphim's death, he was visited by Anthony of Geneva, who was even at that time, coercing and blackmailing bishops, priests, monastics, and laity to consider joining the MP. It was primarily Anthony of Geneva who spearheaded the move of the ROCOR to join the MP. From what I have read of him, I think he was a KGB agent as was most likely Anthony Bloom of the UK. (Incidentally, Vladimir Moss and his wife wrote about Anthony Bloom and a suspicious murder which occurred during one of his pastoral visits.) During the ten years that proceeded the MP-ROCOR union, whenever Anthony of Geneva visited his fellow hierarchs, an argument was witnessed, a death, or a capitulation to the MP occurred. It was just too coincidental.

I would have never guessed that! I'll make sure to check out that article.

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Re: Is Father Seraphim Rose a heretic?

Postby d9popov » Sat 30 September 2017 10:25 pm

Dear NotChrysostomYet: I highly recommend that you read Father George Dragas's entire scholarly paper on the reception of heterodox into the Orthodox Church: http://www.myriobiblos.gr/texts/english ... holic.html. Unfortunately, you have to click on 8 distinct links to view the whole paper --- but it is worth it. It refutes some of the misinformation that Father John Erickson has been propagating in the OCA. Dragas's paper is scholarly whereas Erickson's papers have not been. The facts support baptism as the norm and chrismation or confession as a form of oikonomia. The use of the term oikonomia in referring to receiving heretics with less than baptism goes back at least to the fourth century (as Orthodox and Roman Catholic scholars have demonstrated). Erickson and others are totally off base when they claim that Saint Nicodemus was an innovator in what he said about chrismation being an act of oikonomia. Erickson distorts factual, verifiable history in order to support his ecumenist tendencies. There is a lot more that I could post to prove all of this, but if you want to know the truth, start with the facts and footnotes in Dragas's article. With everyone knowing the basic facts, we can then discuss some of the nuances. The apostolic canons, which all bishops-elect promise to follow, teach clearly that baptism of all heretics is normative. The Russian Church followed this for many centuries. The Greek (and non-Greek Balkan) churches worldwide followed this for several centuries. To deviate can only be justified by oikonomia --- and this oikonomia is discussed by great Fathers of the fourth century. Erickson and some other postmodernists in the OCA simply do not know what they are talking about on this issue when they slander Saint Nicodemus as an innovator. Trying to justify ecumenism drives people to slander our saints of old. Sad. READ DRAGAS!

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Re: Is Father Seraphim Rose a heretic?

Postby NotChrysostomYet » Sat 30 September 2017 11:10 pm

The point remains the same, however. Fr. Seraphim may very well have not used the term (forgive me for that, I was recalling from memory), but the position he was defending was the same.

As for Metropolitan Philaret of New York, my understanding is that he was condemning those who descended from the Paris school and the Orthodox Church in America (which, I will admit, could be justifiably seen as schismatic by ROCOR since the Metropolia had signed an agreement with them previously). Fr. Seraphim Rose, clearly someone who was loyal to ROCOR, would have doubtless held this position as well. But Metropolitan Philaret was not referring to the Moscow Patriarchate, which is what this thread and my response was about. If I am mistaken, however, please point me in the right direction.

Regarding the Holy Transfiguration Monastery in Boston and their home-grown "synod": HOCNA are ultra-strict bad guys who are ultra-strict on everyone but themselves, and all association with them is to be avoided like the plague. They are sexually-addicted wolves in sheep's clothing who steal easily-manipulated Christian souls through sweet talk of Russian westernism and Athonite superiority, and then leave them to be devoured in complacency. I must not be any less clear! For that matter, as the Boston monks' deceptions became more and more apparent, Fr. Seraphim Rose advised everyone to avoid them as well. Forgive me, I realize that it was not the sole purpose of your reply to defend HOCNA, but your post made it out as though HOCNA is defendable, when they are not. Perhaps that one statement of theirs said that, yes, but do not be deceived. Any Orthodox Christian - Old Calendarist or not - and indeed any Christian, for that matter, should condemn them as well. Their only hope is to repent and join Orthodoxy.


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