Modernism in the RCC & WO vs. Traditionalism in TOCs

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Maria
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Re: Modernism in the RCC & WO vs. Traditionalism in TOCs

Post by Maria »

QUANTO CONFICIAMUR MOERORE

ENCYCLICAL OF POPE PIUS IX

AUGUST 10, 1863

To Our Beloved Sons, S. R. E. Cardinals and to Our Venerable Brothers, the Archbishops and Bishops of Italy.

Our Beloved Sons and Venerable Brothers, Greetings and Apostolic Benediction.

How much cause we have to grieve over the most cruel and sacrilegious war brought upon the Catholic Church in almost all regions of the world during these turbulent times, and especially declared upon unhappy Italy before our very eyes many years ago by the Piedmontese Government and stirred up more violently day by day, each of you, our beloved sons and venerable brothers, easily understands. In the midst of our great distress, however, as long as you keep watch with us, we are deeply comforted and consoled. Although you are, indeed, most deplorably harassed by every grave injustice possible, torn away from your own flock, exiled and even cast into prison, nevertheless, with your profound virtue you have never neglected to speak and to write in ardent defense of the teachings of God, his Church, and this Apostolic See.

  1. Consequently, we give thanks because you fervently rejoice to suffer insult in the name of Jesus. We extend to you merited praise in the words of our most saintly predecessor, Leo: "May you endure with all your heart the trials of your love, which you have undergone in reverence for the Catholic faith; may I accept the sufferings inflicted upon you as if I were bearing them myself. I know, however, that it is a cause of joy rather than of sorrow that with the strength of our Lord, Jesus Christ, you have persevered invincible in your evangelical and apostolic teaching . . . And when the enemies of the Christian faith were tearing you away from your respective churches, rather than being contaminated by their impiety, you preferred to endure the injustice of undergoing exile."[1]

  2. Would that we could announce the end of such terrible calamities besetting the Church! Never will there be grief enough over the corruption of morals so extensively increasing and promoted by irreligious and obscene writings, theatrical spectacles and meretricious houses established almost everywhere; by other depraved arts and monstrous portents of every error disseminated in all directions; by the abominable impurities of all vices and crimes growing constantly and the deadly virus of unbelief and indifferentism spread far and wide; by contempt for ecclesiastical authority, sacred things, and laws and by the outrageous plundering of Church possessions; by the bitter and constant abuse of consecrated Church officials, of the students of religious communities, of virgins dedicated to God; by the diabolical hatred of Christ, his Church, teaching, and of this Apostolic See. These and almost innumerable other evils perpetrated by the embittered enemies of the Catholic Church and faith, we are daily compelled to lament.

  3. All these agonies seem to prolong and delay that most yearned for time when we shall see the full triumph of our most holy religion, of justice, and of truth. This triumph cannot fail us, however, even if it is not given us to know the time destined for it by almighty God. Even though our heavenly Father permits his holy Church to be afflicted and plagued by various tribulations and distresses while serving during this most miserable and earthly pilgrimage, nevertheless, because it has been founded by Christ, the Lord, upon an immovable and most firm rock, it cannot be shaken or overthrown by any force or violence. Rather, "it is strengthened, not weakened by persecutions. The Lord's vineyard is always clothed with a richer harvest, for while each grain dies singly, it is born again many fold."[2]

  4. That is what we see happening, beloved sons and venerable brothers, even in these most sorrowful times as a special blessing from God. For although the immaculate Spouse of Christ may be vehemently troubled at the present time by the work of the wicked, yet she is triumphing over her enemies. Yes, indeed, she is conquering her enemies and shines wonderfully bright with your unparalleled faithfulness, love, and respect towards us and this Chair of Peter, and with your outstanding constancy and that of the other venerable brothers, the bishops of the whole Catholic world. She shines with many pious works of Christian charity multiplying rapidly each day; with the light of blessed faith illuminating many regions evermore each day; with the exceptional love and devotion shown by Catholics towards the Church itself, towards us, and this Holy See; with the eminent and immortal glory of martyrdom. You know, in fact, how in Tonkin and especially in the regions of Cochin China, bishops, priests, laymen and even peaceful women themselves, and young boys and girls, emulating the martyrs with their unconquerable spirit and heroic virtue, disdained the most inhuman torture, and greatly rejoiced to pour out their lives for Christ. All these joys should be no slight consolation to us and to you in the midst of the overwhelming anguish that torments us.

  5. Now, since our Apostolic Office demands we carefully and zealously defend the cause of the Church committed to us by Christ, we condemn those who attack and despise the Church itself, its sacred laws, ministers, and this Apostolic See. Hence, with this letter, once more we confirm, proclaim and condemn totally and singly that which in many consistorial allocutions and in our other Letters we have been forced to deplore, declare and condemn.[3]

  6. Here, too, our beloved sons and venerable brothers, it is again necessary to mention and censure a very grave error entrapping some Catholics who believe that it is possible to arrive at eternal salvation although living in error and alienated from the true faith and Catholic unity. Such belief is certainly opposed to Catholic teaching. There are, of course, those who are struggling with invincible ignorance about our most holy religion. Sincerely observing the natural law and its precepts inscribed by God on all hearts and ready to obey God, they live honest lives and are able to attain eternal life by the efficacious virtue of divine light and grace. Because God knows, searches and clearly understands the minds, hearts, thoughts, and nature of all, his supreme kindness and clemency do not permit anyone at all who is not guilty of deliberate sin to suffer eternal punishments.

Notice the discrepancy. The first bolded quote says that one cannot attain eternal life if they are living in error and alienated from the True faith and Catholic unity.

Orthodox Christians also believe in the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Faith, which we believe is the True Orthodox Church, which has maintained the Holy Faith once delivered by Christ to His Apostles for all peoples and for all times (the very definition of Catholic, which is universally taught to every generation).

The second bolded blue quote contradicts the first quote, and introduces the error of invincible ignorance. From whence did this teaching come? Christ did not teach this to His Apostles, nor is it found in the Bible. Apparently, it originated with Thomas Aquinas. However, this is a serious error which has guided all recent popes unto this day. Pope Francis now teaches that atheists of good will can enter heaven, Jews of good will can enter heaven, and even Muslims and Buddhists can enter heaven. This is the pan-heresy of syncretism and ecumenism: that men of good will can be saved. It leads to a feel good religion of the Anti-christ.

  • The first Pope to use the term officially seems to have been Pope Pius IX in the allocution Singulari Quadam (9 December 1854) and the encyclicals Singulari Quidem (17 March 1856) and Quanto Conficiamur Moerore (10 August 1863). The term, however, is far older than that. Aquinas, for instance, uses it in his Summa Theologica (written 1265–1274),[2] and discussion of the concept can be found as far back as Origen (3rd century). When and how the term was taken by logicians to refer to the very different state of persons who deliberately refuse to attend to evidence remains unclear, but one of its first uses was in the book Fallacy: The Counterfeit of Argument by W. Ward Fearnside and William B. Holther.[3]

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invincibl ... ce_fallacy

QUANTO CONFICIAMUR MOERORE (continued)

8. Also well known is the Catholic teaching that no one can be saved outside the Catholic Church. Eternal salvation cannot be obtained by those who oppose the authority and statements of the same Church and are stubbornly separated from the unity of the Church and also from the successor of Peter, the Roman Pontiff, to whom "the custody of the vineyard has been committed by the Savior." [4] The words of Christ are clear enough: "If he refuses to listen even to the Church, let him be to you a Gentile and a tax collector;"[5] "He who hears you hears me, and he who rejects you, rejects me, and he who rejects me, rejects him who sent me;"[6] "He who does not believe will be condemned;"[7] "He who does not believe is already condemned;"[8] "He who is not with me is against me, and he who does not gather with me scatters."[9] The Apostle Paul says that such persons are "perverted and self-condemned;"[10] the Prince of the Apostles calls them "false teachers . . . who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master. . . bringing upon themselves swift destruction."[11]

The Orthodox also believe this statement from Saint Cyprian of Carthage, a bishop of the 3rd century, at a time before the Great Schism of 1054 A.D. "Outside the Church there is no salvation," because the Church is the Bride of Christ, and was established by Christ.

9. God forbid that the children of the Catholic Church should even in any way be unfriendly to those who are not at all united to us by the same bonds of faith and love. On the contrary, let them be eager always to attend to their needs with all the kind services of Christian charity, whether they are poor or sick or suffering any other kind of visitation. First of all, let them rescue them from the darkness of the errors into which they have unhappily fallen and strive to guide them back to Catholic truth and to their most loving Mother who is ever holding out her maternal arms to receive them lovingly back into her fold. Thus, firmly founded in faith, hope, and charity and fruitful in every good work, they will gain eternal salvation.

Taking care of the basic physical needs of the poor is important, but charity also requires that we preach the Truth, which is Christ, in love too as we are to instruct the ignorant.

Unfortunately, the Pope does not recognize the heretical errors of the past, which have split Rome from the Holy Catholic and Orthodox Church. Rome remains in schism and in heresy to this day. As a result of the loss of grace, Rome has increased its errors with increased papal powers (1870 dogmas of Papal Supremacy and Papal Infallibility), with changes in the Ancient Holy Canons in 1917 and again in 1983, with continual liturgical changes from 600 A.D., with altar girls and female Eucharistic ministers, with the addition of a Protestant Lutheran Mass in 1963, called the Novus Ordo, with the desecration of this Mass with clown and beer "liturgies" that are in no way divine, with the tampering of all the sacraments, and with the adulteration of the sacred texts used during the "Mass," so that gender inclusive language is used leading to the confusion of the faithful.

Just after my son made his first holy communion in 1992, a year later the choir at St. James Catholic Church sang, "Her Name is Jesus." Immediately, we left and started our long search for the True Church. We found ourselves in the Melkite Eastern Catholic Church because some of our friends had heard that the Melkites were part of the Orthodox Church ... At our first meeting with a Melkite priest on August 1, 1993, he told us that the Melkites believed that the Orthodox Church was not heretical. Therefore, we asked him if we could attend Catechism Classes at St. Sophia's Greek Orthodox Cathedral. He did not object, so we started our inquiry into Orthodoxy. Finally, we left the Melkite Church in September 1995, and were received into the Orthodox Catechumenate on October 1, 1995, The Feast of the Holy Protection of the Theotokos.

Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy on me a sinner.

sedevacantist
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Re: Modernism in the RCC & WO vs. Traditionalism in TOCs

Post by sedevacantist »

notice again that Pope Pius IX does not say anywhere that the invincibly ignorant can be saved where they are. Rather, he is reiterating that the ignorant, if they cooperate with God’s grace, keep the natural law and respond to God’s call, they can by God’s “operating power of divine light and grace” [being enlightened by the truth of the Gospel] attain eternal life, since God will certainly bring all of his elect to the knowledge of the truth and into the Church by baptism. According to the specific definition of Sacred Scripture, “divine light” is the Gospel truth of Jesus Christ (the Catholic Faith) which removes the ignorant from darkness.

Ephesians 5:8 “For you were heretofore darkness, but now light in the Lord. Walk then as children of the light.”

1 Thess. 5:4-5 “But you, brethren [believers], are not in darkness… For all you are the children of the light.”

Colossians 1:12-13: “Giving thanks to God the Father, who hath made us worthy to be partakers of the lot of the saints in light: Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of the Son of His love.”

1 Peter 2:9: “But you are a chosen generation… a purchased people: that you may declare his virtues, who hath called you out of darkness into His marvelous light.”

2 Corinthians 4:3-4: “And if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost, In whom the god of this world [Satan] hath blinded the minds of unbelievers, that the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should not shine unto them.”

2 Timothy 1:10: “But is now made manifest by the illumination of our Savior Jesus Christ, who hath destroyed death, and hath brought to light life and incorruption by the Gospel.”

Pope Pius IX, Vatican I (+1870): “… no one can ‘assent to the preaching of the Gospel,’ as he must to attain salvation, without the illumination and inspiration of the Holy Spirit, who gives to all a sweetness in consenting to and believing the truth.”[ccxcviii]

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  So, we must not interpret Pius IX’s words in Quanto Conficiamur Moerore about the good-willed ignorant being saved by receiving “divine light and grace” contrary to their clear scriptural and Traditional meaning, which is that divine light and grace is received by hearing of the Gospel, believing it and being baptized.  Thus, in Quanto Conficiamur Moerore, Pius IX is saying that the good-willed, sincere person who is ignorant of the Faith will be “illuminated” by receiving the “divine light” (hearing the Gospel) and will enter the Catholic Church so that he can be saved.

 

  I realize that Pope Pius IX was not nearly as clear as he could have been in the second half of Quanto Conficiamur Moerore.  The heretics have had a field day with it, because they think that they can exploit its wording to favor their heresy that there is salvation outside the Church.  If Pope Pius IX had repeated in a strong way the previous definitions of the popes, without any ambiguous language, he would have avoided the danger of modernists misinterpreting his words.   This is a shame because almost all of his statements on this topic do very clearly affirm Church dogma without any ambiguity that heretics can jump on.

Pope Pius IX, Nostis et Nobiscum (# 10), Dec. 8, 1849: “In particular, ensure that the faithful are deeply and thoroughly convinced of the truth of the doctrine that the Catholic faith is necessary for attaining salvation. (This doctrine, received from Christ and emphasized by the Fathers and Councils, is also contained in the formulae of the profession of faith used by Latin, Greek and Oriental Catholics).”[ccxcix]

Pope Pius IX, Ubi primum (# 10), June 17, 1847: “For ‘there is one universal Church outside of which no one at all is saved; it contains regular and secular prelates along with those under their jurisdiction, who all profess one Lord, one faith and one baptism.”[ccc]

Pope Pius IX- Syllabus of Modern Errors- Proposition 16, Dec. 8, 1854: “Man may, in the observance of any religion whatever, find the way of eternal salvation, and arrive at eternal salvation.” [ccci] – Condemned

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 Notice again that the concept of salvation for the “invincibly ignorant” is condemned here.  The concept of salvation for the “invincibly ignorant,” as it is held by almost everyone who holds it today, is that some men – including those who observe non-Catholic religions – can find and arrive at salvation in these religions because they are “without fault of their own.”  But this is heretical and condemned by Pius IX’s own Syllabus of Errors above.
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Maria
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Re: Modernism in the RCC & WO vs. Traditionalism in TOCs

Post by Maria »

Nevertheless, Pius XI by his vague statement on "invincible ignorance," which is not infallible, opened the door for "development of doctrine" which has lead to the conclusion that all can be saved as long as they are men of goodwill.

This is what Francis is saying, and it is wrong; it is heretical.

Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy on me a sinner.

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Re: Modernism in the RCC & WO vs. Traditionalism in TOCs

Post by Madison Grant »

This looks familiar.

Yes, you sure refuted your own churchmen.

You sound like a Feeneyite, or better said, a Dimondite. If so, and if an American: you have no hierarchy. You have no priests and have no bishops. Not Bishops Dolan and Sanborn of SGG in the east and south east, nor Bishops Kelly and Santay of CSPV in the north east, nor Bishops Pivarunas of CMRI and Neville in the mid west.

The Dimondites stay home on Sunday, as Home Aloners, because the sedevacantist bishops, and their priests with them, are heretical - all of them; and, that is because they strictly utilize seminary textbooks that were in existence prior to the Second Vatican Council, textbooks that are heretical for teaching what the ordinary magisterium taught, that is to say: your own churchmen, who you labeled as heretical, have always taught on the topic of salvation.

No, you are of bad will in coming into Inquiring into Orthodoxy to disgracefully defend Popery.

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Maria
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Re: Modernism in the RCC & WO vs. Traditionalism in TOCs

Post by Maria »

Sedevacantist, are you Old Roman Catholic? Do you deny both Vatican I and Vatican II, but accept the Council of Trent?

Do you see the errors of increased papal powers which place the Roman Pope above all the bishops? Do you see the danger in this, and the danger into which the Ecumenical Patriarch and the Moscow Patriarchate are also falling? All three men believe that they have some sort of infallibility, believe in Machiavellian principles that the ends justify the means, and definitely believe that they alone are supreme.

Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy on me a sinner.

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Maria
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Re: Modernism in the RCC & WO vs. Traditionalism in TOCs

Post by Maria »

A very good video that explains the effects of modernism in Roman Catholicism and in World Orthodoxy is posted below.

I beg you to take the hour to listen to this video produced at Holy Trinity Seminary in New York. It is well worth your time.

at 16:00 in the tape, he explains Dogmatic Theology and why it is important:

Our knowledge of Dogmatic Theology can be compared to the knowledge that engineers must have when constructing bridges. If their knowledge of engineering, physics, and calculus is deficient and if they are told to be quiet and agree to disagree, then they will build bridges that will collapse under the stress of high winds as did the Tacoma Narrows Bridge in Washington State.

In order to construct a solid bridge to Heaven, our bishops and clergy need a good foundation in Orthodox Dogmatic Theology, which includes the Holy Scripture, the writings of the Church Fathers, and all the Ecumenical and local councils. If modernism causes bishops to demean any portion of Orthodox Dogmatic Theology or to act "without prejudice to theological discussion" (as Pope Paul VI suggested), then they can make proclamations that will lead us to damnation, such as proclaiming that fasting and prayers are no longer essential, and that Pascha can be celebrated on the New Calendar, which does not comply with the decisions of the Holy Ecumenical Councils.

Modernism teaches that wearing the cassock and the facial hair are old-fashioned and antithetical to the modern way of life. Oh the contrary, wearing the cassock and not cutting the beard bear witness that humility and obedience to Christ's commandments are essential for salvation.

I could go on, but I urge you to take the time to listen to this excellent video, and to share your own thoughts on the matter.

Oh, he ends his presentation by presenting a picture of the miraculous 1925 Holy Cross over the skies of Athens on the Vigil of the Holy Cross (Old Calendar), Sept. 14/27, 1925.

Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy on me a sinner.

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Re: Modernism in the RCC & WO vs. Traditionalism in TOCs

Post by sedevacantist »

one way to identify the true Church is if you see women wearing head covers in Church...the modernist Churches did away with this tradition, the traditional Catholics still do it

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