Father Seraphim Rose and Cyprianism

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NotChrysostomYet
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Father Seraphim Rose and Cyprianism

Post by NotChrysostomYet »

While Fr. Seraphim Rose did not view the MP's compromise with the Soviet Union as favorable, he always believed that the Moscow Patriarchate still possessed grace. The situation for the Church under Communism isn't as black-and-white as some in Old Calendarism wish it had been, and there were men and women all the way up through the 1980s who were martyred for their faith, even though they belonged to the Moscow Patriarchate.

Fr. Seraphim Rose's recognition of the complexity of the situation definitely does not make him a heretic. It's worth noting that he defends himself against those who accused him of being a "Cyprianite" in the book Letters from Fr. Seraphim, where he argues in a letter that those who accuse him and ROCOR of being Cyprianite are infected with what he called the "correctness disease"; a disease which would cause them to eventually leave ROCOR and the Orthodox Church.

At the time those making these arguments were under ROCOR, but they would leave the Church and eventually form the infamous "Holy Orthodox Church in North America", the home-grown "synod" of Holy Transfiguration Monastery in Boston, MA. Fr. Seraphim's diagnosis tragically proved to be on-point.

d9popov
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Re: Is Father Seraphim Rose a heretic?

Post by d9popov »

NotChrysostomYet wrote:

While Fr. Seraphim Rose did not view the MP's compromise with the Soviet Union as favorable, he always believed that the Moscow Patriarchate still possessed grace. The situation for the Church under Communism isn't as black-and-white as some in Old Calendarism wish it had been, and there were men and women all the way up through the 1980s who were martyred for their faith, even though they belonged to the Moscow Patriarchate.

Fr. Seraphim Rose's recognition of the complexity of the situation definitely does not make him a heretic. It's worth noting that he defends himself against those who accused him of being a "Cyprianite" in the book Letters from Fr. Seraphim, where he argues in a letter that those who accuse him and ROCOR of being Cyprianite are infected with what he called the "correctness disease"; a disease which would cause them to eventually leave ROCOR and the Orthodox Church.

At the time those making these arguments were under ROCOR, but they would leave the Church and eventually form the infamous "Holy Orthodox Church in North America", the home-grown "synod" of Holy Transfiguration Monastery in Boston, MA. Fr. Seraphim's diagnosis tragically proved to be on-point.

We should all be able to agree that the issue of the loss of sacramental grace is a complex issue, but there are also certain dogmas taught by a consensus of the Saints and certain facts that we should not hide. It has been proven elsewhere that major books on Father Seraphim Rose, the Elder Joseph the Hesychast, and Saint John the Romanian (in Jerusalem) have been edited so as to cover up these three men's clearest condemnations of the Sergianists and/or ecumenists. It is unlikely that Father Seraphim could have referred to "Cyprianism," because the term came into use after 1984 and he reposed in 1982!

NotChrysostomYet refers to the Holy Transfiguration Monastery in Boston (HTM-B) and the Holy Orthodox Church in North America (HOCNA) as if they are the ultra-strict bad guys. However, it is a fact that Saint Philaret himself was more strict than HOCNA's official ecclesiology statement about grace. See Saint Philaret's letter where he is clear that the Paris jurisdiction of Russians did not have sacramental grace: http://blessedphilaret.blogspot.com/200 ... alena.html. See HOCNA's more modest statement that "We believe and affirm that, as the Holy Fathers and Holy Canons teach us, according to strictness there is no grace in the Mysteries of those in heresy or schism. However, as we discern from the incidents cited in the letter above, we see that we cannot speak of the precise moment when God, in His wisdom and economia, withdraws His uncreated power and grace from the Mysteries of those who are being led astray."

The error of extreme Mathewitism is that we can KNOW beyond the shadow of a doubt that new calendarists are without efficacious mysteries since 1935 at the latest, and, according to that view, it is justified to condemn such people as Saint Chrysostom (Kavourides) of Florina who had a more nuanced view. The error of extreme Cyprianism (Phyleism) is to claim that we KNOW that all the ecumenist heretics still have efficacious mysteries because they have not been tried and convicted by a major international synod. The truth Orthodox position does not follow either of these extreme errors.

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Maria
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Re: Is Father Seraphim Rose a heretic?

Post by Maria »

I have moved these two posts above into Intra-TOC Polemics because of the polemical content in them.

Polemical posts concerning True Orthodox Synods must be posted in Intra-TOC Polemics.

For example, accusing the Matthewites of extremism and then justifying Met. Chrysostom of Florina as a moderate is taking a polemical position which can pit one church against another. This usually leads to unedifying arguments which the public can view, leading to loss of members. Frankly, this is why this private forum was established.

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Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy on me a sinner.

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Maria
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Re: Father Seraphim Rose and Cyprianism

Post by Maria »

The Synod of St. Matthew which continues under Archbishop Stephanos today does not believe in a "light-switch" approach, that the grace of the sacraments is immediately TURNED OFF like a light switch.

It was the lived experience of the Genuine Church of Greece between 1924 to 1937 such as witnessing the brutal imprisonment and drugging of hierarchs, priests, monastics, and laity (especially of Met. Chrysostom of Florina and St. Matthew), the horrific martyrdom of priests, monastics, and laity, the deliberate starvation of nuns and laity, and the violent murder of priests by Greek State Bishops who were never defrocked for the shedding of blood that led those in the Synod of St. Matthew to conclude that the Greek State Church had lost grace.

Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy on me a sinner.

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