Metropolitan Evloghios of Milan

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Suaiden
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Re: Metropolitan Evloghios of Milan

Postby Suaiden » Mon 14 March 2011 9:44 pm

mmcxristidis wrote:
Well Mr. Suaiden, it looks like your buddy Fr. Anastasios's friends, the Ekklisiasticos mafia don't respect your Milan group very highly at all, sounds like they may view it as some kind of alternate Orthodox bizarro world. Perhaps you could get them to come on your internet radio show to chew the fat, now that would be interesting, I may even tune in for that one myself. LOL


Well, Minas, I am sorry to see that you are now so off the deep end you can't use an ecclesiastical title in reference to me, but apparently can with World Orthodox clergy (and, thankfully, some True Orthodox clergy). You could at least call me "Joe", as we used to be friends. You seem to be unaware that the same Bishops who made the Synod-in-Resistance (and thus the ROCOR-A) were once in communion with us, and that Metropolitan Evloghios was once in communion with Abp Chrysostomos of Etna, your Bishop (allegedly, if you are actually under obedience to anyone besides the remnant refugee mousemole movement).So you seem to be shooting yourself in the foot by taking potshots at me for your own amusement.

I, for one, know that there is a great deal of confusion regarding recent events in Milan and in regards to our Synod. Thus, while I am not always a fan of Ekklesiastikos' phrasing, it's a legitimate question. I'd be glad to have a reasoned discussion on the events. I think in some ways they were largely positive, but I qualify that by saying that this does not mean that things can't-- or don't-- go wrong.

A legitimate question phrased tersely doesn't make a person a monster-- or a mole. To paraphrase St Maximos, if it can be discussed with a cool head and without anger, we can get to the bottom of the question at hand.
Deacon Joseph Suaiden and Family
St Eulalia Orthodox Mission (Autonomous Orthodox Metropolia of North and South America and the British Isles)
The Messaging System Here is occasionally spotty. Please send messages directly to my email: DCNJOSEPH AT ZOHO DOT COM

Mark Templet
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Re: Metropolitan Evloghios of Milan

Postby Mark Templet » Tue 15 March 2011 1:30 pm

I, for one, know that there is a great deal of confusion regarding recent events in Milan and in regards to our Synod. Thus, while I am not always a fan of Ekklesiastikos' phrasing, it's a legitimate question. I'd be glad to have a reasoned discussion on the events. I think in some ways they were largely positive, but I qualify that by saying that this does not mean that things can't-- or don't-- go wrong.

A legitimate question phrased tersely doesn't make a person a monster-- or a mole. To paraphrase St Maximos, if it can be discussed with a cool head and without anger, we can get to the bottom of the question at hand.


Good For you Father! I think Fr. Joe has been quite up front with the situation of the Milan Synod; he has not knee-jerked into a defensive posture, or worse yet an offensive posture. He is right, there are some heavy questions here, but they should be posed with respect. We True Orthodox are always so ready to tear each others face off at the first opening, it is shameful.

So, let's have a reasonable and respectful discussion:

Fr. Joe, I have heard, and I admit that it is not from an eye witness, that in Milan your synod engages or has engaged in giving communion to the non-Orthodox. I am sure this is not the first time you have heard this accusation. Do you know what incident(s) this could stem from and what happened. With the recent issues that we are discussing here, you can imagine why this may cause some of us to wonder about the Milan Synod's position on the World Orthodox. Can you help us get a better handle on this?

And let's all have the courage to let Fr. Joe give the first answer without jumping in line; let the man give his to this question.
Fr. Mark Templet
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mmcxristidis
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Re: Metropolitan Evloghios of Milan

Postby mmcxristidis » Tue 15 March 2011 4:48 pm

Suaiden wrote:
mmcxristidis wrote:
Well Mr. Suaiden, it looks like your buddy Fr. Anastasios's friends, the Ekklisiasticos mafia don't respect your Milan group very highly at all, sounds like they may view it as some kind of alternate Orthodox bizarro world. Perhaps you could get them to come on your internet radio show to chew the fat, now that would be interesting, I may even tune in for that one myself. LOL


Well, Minas, I am sorry to see that you are now so off the deep end you can't use an ecclesiastical title in reference to me, but apparently can with World Orthodox clergy (and, thankfully, some True Orthodox clergy). You could at least call me "Joe", as we used to be friends. You seem to be unaware that the same Bishops who made the Synod-in-Resistance (and thus the ROCOR-A) were once in communion with us, and that Metropolitan Evloghios was once in communion with Abp Chrysostomos of Etna, your Bishop (allegedly, if you are actually under obedience to anyone besides the remnant refugee mousemole movement).So you seem to be shooting yourself in the foot by taking potshots at me for your own amusement.

I, for one, know that there is a great deal of confusion regarding recent events in Milan and in regards to our Synod. Thus, while I am not always a fan of Ekklesiastikos' phrasing, it's a legitimate question. I'd be glad to have a reasoned discussion on the events. I think in some ways they were largely positive, but I qualify that by saying that this does not mean that things can't-- or don't-- go wrong.

A legitimate question phrased tersely doesn't make a person a monster-- or a mole. To paraphrase St Maximos, if it can be discussed with a cool head and without anger, we can get to the bottom of the question at hand.


Well, Mr Joseph Mahmoud Suaiden, If I'm off the deep end then you have sunk to the seabed and are a bottom feeder. It's easy for most to see you are a egomaniac with your many internet blogs and comments everywhere and your love of appearing as some Orthodox authority on just about every subject that may arise. With your many words and excuses defending your Milan group and their doings no matter what they may be. Now from reading about recent events, the independence of the USA group from the European. and the European group recognizing World Orthodoxy and the MP you say it doesn't matter and your new Milan group still doesn't accept what they are doing, and you won't go along with them no matter what, what a mess this Milan has become. I believe the fact of the matter is that if your new "independent Metropolitan John begins accepting World Orthodoxy, which I think will happen, and tells you you must also, and to shut up, then you will go right along with it. Why ?, well that's simple. because you are a megalomaniac who loves the spotlight and you know that if you were to leave the Milan Synod and try to go elsewhere, you wouldn't be accepted with the title of deacon or perhaps by then priest, and I know you just couldn't be so humble as to accept being subjected to the role of a mere layman. Fact is, only a vagante synod would give you the title of deacon, Why, simple, you don't qualify, you have been married and divorced, no matter what you may say, I mean, you have a son, Joe Jr., with your first wife. That fact makes your first marriage legit in my book, no matter how you want to spin the facts. Your wife now, has also been married and divorced, no matter if your Metropolitan decrees it was never so and declares it not so.
if it's true, as you say, that the SIR and ROCOR were ever in communion with Milan then it's certainly not true now. Vagante groups have weaseled their way in and out of legit synods in the past, doesn't make them any less vagante.
You claim we were friends. I believe your idea of friendship is "what can I get out of this to promote my own causes and idea's". When one less useful friendship begins to interfere with another more useful one, they are no longer your "friend".
I would advise Fr. Anastasios and your other friends to reexamine what your "friendship"really is, and how associating with you makes them appear to more intelligent members of their own synod, and if it's really in their best interests to accept every excuse you make defending your group. Joanna was your "friend also, when she was less informed and aware of what you were trying to achieve. Remember a while back, when you wrote in this forum about your financial woes with not being able to pay your rent, and asking people here for money ? She was one of the first to respond and send you 50 bucks, and asking other to also send you $50. now she is useless, just a crazy old "mousemole", as I am also to you, Thank God.

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Suaiden
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Re: Metropolitan Evloghios of Milan

Postby Suaiden » Tue 15 March 2011 8:44 pm

Bless!

Mark Templet wrote: Good For you Father! I think Fr. Joe has been quite up front with the situation of the Milan Synod; he has not knee-jerked into a defensive posture, or worse yet an offensive posture. He is right, there are some heavy questions here, but they should be posed with respect. We True Orthodox are always so ready to tear each others face off at the first opening, it is shameful.


Thanks, Father, much appreciated. Although I actually *do* prefer "Fr Joseph", I only meant that for Minas, I'd appreciate the recognition of familiarity. Calling me "Mr. Suaiden" like he doesn't know me is really hurtful. We used to consider each other friends, and I am really stung by the events of the past year.

Mark Templet wrote:So, let's have a reasonable and respectful discussion:

Fr. Joe, I have heard, and I admit that it is not from an eye witness, that in Milan your synod engages or has engaged in giving communion to the non-Orthodox. I am sure this is not the first time you have heard this accusation. Do you know what incident(s) this could stem from and what happened. With the recent issues that we are discussing here, you can imagine why this may cause some of us to wonder about the Milan Synod's position on the World Orthodox. Can you help us get a better handle on this?

And let's all have the courage to let Fr. Joe give the first answer without jumping in line; let the man give his to this question.


Well, it's a fair question and I am not going to lie. Milan's historical position on giving communion to World Orthodox is admittedly spotty. (I do know that the Monophysites in Italy in the past couple of years who joined our Church were actually received into our Church, not simply given communion.) Before this, however, there was the famous "Santa De Ladiera" ecumenist seer-woman in Portugal recorded in Moss' history of True Orthodoxy. Unfortunately, though he ties this all into our Synod (and gets a couple of other historical issues concerning Her wrong, despite my attempts to protest occasionally, with little faith in a change), in fact this occurred after the departure of the Portuguese Bishop in 1990.

For my part, I know nothing and have heard nothing about giving communion to undisputed heterodox (RC's, Protestants, et cetera). They are all baptized and have confirmation of that fact from Italy. On World Orthodoxy, however, as I understand it, the Synod has vacillated between a strict position on World Orthodoxy and a really soft one, depending on the year. That said, the position of our Metropolia (formerly our American Archdioceses) has been for years to receive people in from World Orthodoxy either by confession and repentance or chrismation; that can be verified easily with our Metropolitan. However, even this, combined with the mixed messages coming from Milan, led to abuses.

This was part of the reason the clergy confession was released: to finally make clear with our canonical independence that there must be consistency in our confession of faith. For the most part, the clergy have been extremely receptive and oftentimes grateful to take a clearer stand. Of course, there are a couple of vocal dissenters. But they are literally-- a couple out of 30 or so major clergy.

Hope that helps for a beginning of the discussion.
Deacon Joseph Suaiden and Family
St Eulalia Orthodox Mission (Autonomous Orthodox Metropolia of North and South America and the British Isles)
The Messaging System Here is occasionally spotty. Please send messages directly to my email: DCNJOSEPH AT ZOHO DOT COM

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Suaiden
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Re: Metropolitan Evloghios of Milan

Postby Suaiden » Tue 15 March 2011 9:21 pm

mmcxristidis wrote:Well, Mr Joseph Mahmoud Suaiden, If I'm off the deep end then you have sunk to the seabed and are a bottom feeder. It's easy for most to see you are a egomaniac with your many internet blogs and comments everywhere and your love of appearing as some Orthodox authority on just about every subject that may arise. With your many words and excuses defending your Milan group and their doings no matter what they may be.


Wow.

Now from reading about recent events, the independence of the USA group from the European. and the European group recognizing World Orthodoxy and the MP you say it doesn't matter and your new Milan group still doesn't accept what they are doing, and you won't go along with them no matter what, what a mess this Milan has become. I believe the fact of the matter is that if your new "independent Metropolitan John begins accepting World Orthodoxy, which I think will happen, and tells you you must also, and to shut up, then you will go right along with it. Why ?, well that's simple. because you are a megalomaniac who loves the spotlight and you know that if you were to leave the Milan Synod and try to go elsewhere, you wouldn't be accepted with the title of deacon or perhaps by then priest, and I know you just couldn't be so humble as to accept being subjected to the role of a mere layman.


Well, I am not going to get into how I'd be received if I left (because the truth is I don't know) but I will tell you that on bad days it would have been a relief to be "just Joe" again and gone to an established parish Church, rather than horribly running a little house mission in our Synod. I've considered-- many times-- submitting a resignation, getting deposed, and heading over to a nearby established Church in another jurisdiction. I haven't seen the inside of a bar in years. I used to like going and having a beer every so often. (There is debate about whether I can attend a soccer game, so I don't even try). I haven't been able to freely write the way I used to when I was a layman. Now I am accountable to everyone who hates me or what I wrote complaining to my Bishop and forcing a retraction. I'm a hundred times more accountable now when I miss services. And I could be late. I used to go every other week and was perfectly happy. I could listen to whatever music I wanted all the time and no one cared. All so that I could stand at altar and exhaust myself in front of the Body and Blood of our Lord that I am a million times more certain now than I was before that I am UNWORTHY TO RECEIVE.

Oh yeah, and I get to have random lunatics on the Internet telling me I am a fake clergyman. LUCKY ME!

For the record, Metropolitan John knows-- and has known for years-- that I do not recognize the Moscow Patriarchate and World Orthodoxy, so don't worry, we have much more disclosure on our views than you think. If you'd like his views, read the clergy confession, which he said accurately encapsulates his ecclesiological position. I am actually quite sure he will *not* go to World Orthodoxy, far more so than you, because I actually talk to him, not about him.

Fact is, only a vagante synod would give you the title of deacon, Why, simple, you don't qualify, you have been married and divorced, no matter what you may say, I mean, you have a son, Joe Jr., with your first wife. That fact makes your first marriage legit in my book, no matter how you want to spin the facts. Your wife now, has also been married and divorced, no matter if your Metropolitan decrees it was never so and declares it not so.


Well, thank God you don't comprise the canonical authority of the Church vested in her Bishops, who actually require investigations into matters. You just pretend to be a dog on Facebook and try to talk to other men's wives. Watch your mouth.

if it's true, as you say, that the SIR and ROCOR were ever in communion with Milan then it's certainly not true now. Vagante groups have weaseled their way in and out of legit synods in the past, doesn't make them any less vagante.


Actually, I never said "SiR and ROCOR". I said "the SiR", which you claim to be a part of. Milan's Bishops were in communion with the SiR at the end of the 80's-early 90's. By contrast, the SiR entered into communion with ROCOR in 1994.

You claim we were friends. I believe your idea of friendship is "what can I get out of this to promote my own causes and idea's". When one less useful friendship begins to interfere with another more useful one, they are no longer your "friend".


Actually, my friends would also know that I received headaches from you because of your belligerence towards others.

I would advise Fr. Anastasios and your other friends to reexamine what your "friendship"really is, and how associating with you makes them appear to more intelligent members of their own synod, and if it's really in their best interests to accept every excuse you make defending your group.


Who said my friends agree with me on everything? They're *my* friends. Not "Metropolitan Evloghios' friends.

Joanna was your "friend also, when she was less informed and aware of what you were trying to achieve. Remember a while back, when you wrote in this forum about your financial woes with not being able to pay your rent, and asking people here for money ? She was one of the first to respond and send you 50 bucks, and asking other to also send you $50. now she is useless, just a crazy old "mousemole", as I am also to you, Thank God.


I am thankful to over three dozen people who helped us during that time, and that includes Joanna. We have different sections of prayers to read for each of them which we read in our prayers, and have ever since they helped us back then until the present as our benefactors, to the very end of our lives.

Yet a word of advice: when you give to the poor, the left hand should never know what the right hand is doing, for an evilly-intended statement can suck the grace right out of a very good action. Prudence would have dictated to you never to mention the good she did for us, for no matter how evil you and she may believe me to be, the Lord would have accepted the alms. You have obviously shown you have more than enough to humiliate me with. Now you risk having robbed that grace. Great "politics", but bad spirituality.
Deacon Joseph Suaiden and Family
St Eulalia Orthodox Mission (Autonomous Orthodox Metropolia of North and South America and the British Isles)
The Messaging System Here is occasionally spotty. Please send messages directly to my email: DCNJOSEPH AT ZOHO DOT COM

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mmcxristidis
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Re: Metropolitan Evloghios of Milan

Postby mmcxristidis » Tue 15 March 2011 9:54 pm

I pretend to be a dog on Facebook ? I try to speak to other peoples wives ? Iv already explained to you that i mistakenly sent a message to your wife thinking it was you since you both had that "Orthodoxy or Death" logo on your profile. I had remembered you from St. Vladimir's in Miami when I had met you for the first and only (thankfully) time when you had run away from your Roman Catholic mother and Muslim fathers home to make a name for yourself in the "Orthodox" world. well, you've come a long way since then, haven't you. After you both jumped all over me when I tried to explain myself at that time I just backed off politely and went on about my way, writing you both off as some unreasonable nuts. Later, when I had stupidly agree to join your ragtag NFTU outfit (dumb and dumber me), I felt I should let you know I was the one on Facebook, years before, and we both had a laugh about it. Had I told you who I was without the benefit of now being your star reporter, doing so much work for you at the time, I'm sure you and your second wife would have resumed your attack on me as some kind of internet troll. Believe me, Iv seen your wife's photo's and I would never be interested in her, even if she were available and willing, nuff said !
As for the rest of your reply, keep crying us all a river and maybe a few simple minds will start to believe your some kind of saint. And yes, I do have some more dirt on you in regards to some statements made about others in your Milan and your "friends", I'll leave it at that for now.
Now, one more thing, I never said I gave any monies to you, and Joanna, she just wrote a reply to your post here asking for money and mentioning she gave you 50 bucks and encouraging others here to do so in order to help you, setting an example. I hardly think that was her sounding a trumpet as to her good works which shows how little you appreciate anything she did to help you by trying to make her sound bad now.
Now, why don't you post a reply to this and I will let you have the last word so you can get a good night's sleep (I know it's a policy of yours to always get the last word on any subject, par course for an egomaniac). Wishing you a good Lent

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Re: Metropolitan Evloghios of Milan

Postby jgress » Wed 16 March 2011 1:38 am

Well, Minas, I think you have two choices now. You can apologize and ask forgiveness of Dcn Joseph for your slander, or you can be banned from the forum.


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