ROCOR was ecumenist from the beginning

[Maria]

Archbishop Theophilius was a New Calendar Romanian Archbishop inside ROCOR. They followed the New Calendar.At the time (early 1950's) St. Victor Leu of Romania was kidnapped in Vienna by the KGB and brought to Moscow to be interrogated by Beria himself. He later spent many years in the Romanian Gulag and suffered greatly but never was broken.

He was ordained by ROCOR after WW2 but they threw him under the bus and never tried to defend him at all and will not canonize him now (nor any of the Russian TOC's) although he suffered more then all of the normal saints (Matthew, John, Nicholai, Philaret etc) put together.

So at the same time St. Victor was being kidnapped, St. John of San Francisco decided to accept the Dutch and Romanian parish in Paris under the New Calendar with the hope that they would come to their senses. RTOC defends this by saying that when a ROCOR bishop visited Lesna- they would serve with them under the OC as a justification. I do not agree with that defense at all.

I am confused by your use of pronouns.

Original post:
http://www.euphrosynoscafe.com/forum/vi ... =28#p72774

Maria,
Administrator

[jdigrande]

I was a member of the Church in Erie and had a house there until it joined the Moscow Patriarchate.

The Belakrinitsa hierarchy existed in the 19th century and was started by a Greek Bishop from Constantinople who agreed to take the Old Believers of the Lower Danube mission under his wing. They later canonized him. The Old Rite under this hierarchy has an extensive parishes in Ukraine.

St. Philaret and ROCOR wrote this apology not to the Erie parish but to the Old Believers in Oregon Bishop Nektary then went to visit them and did a full prostration in front of them after the ROCOR decree was issued. A short time later part of the Oregon Old Believer community put themselves under the Belakrinitza hierarchy and they have priests. The Erie parish in now under the MP/ROCOR.

This ROCOR document of 1974 signed by the whole synod and St. Philaret can be read at:

http://www.rocorstudies.org/2015/02/27/ ... -in-oregon

this whole story is an interesting take on life in the 1970's in Oregon and the interrelationship between ROCOR and this group.

Please forgive me for posting polemical things on this thread. I hope Maria can move it over to the TOC polemics.

[jdigrande]

This reply is to the question asked by Maria: "Who was St. John?"

St. John Maximovitch is the answer.

[jdigrande]

Maria:

I am not sure how to edit this post. Do I retype the whole thing minus the phrase ("threw him under the bus") or remove all personal opinions on the split in Greece which should be on the polemical page instead.

Dear Joseph,

Now that this thread has already been split, please repost your message with corrections in the use of pronouns in Intra-TOC Polemics. I will copy, move, and edit appropriately. Perhaps only one or two paragraphs need corrections.

Thanks,

Maria
Administrator

[jdigrande]

Here is the edit of the post that some of you objected to:

Archbishop Theophilius Ionescu was the NC Romanian Archbishop within ROCOR from the early 1950's to 1972 when he passed away. At the time of his inclusion in ROCOR (where among other things he served the NC community in Paris) St. Victor Leu was kidnapped in Vienna by the KGB and spent the next 26 years in the Soviet and Romanian Gulags. ST. Victor was ordained a bishop by ROCOR in the late 40's in Austria The full account of his life can be found at:

http://www.rocorstudies.org/2010/01/16/ ... ern-europe

The extensive comments posted at the end of his life provide more context

ROCOR did not publicly object to his kidnapping in 1952 but instead concentrated on the welfare of the New Calendar Romanians within ROCOR. This followed their policy of not supporting the OC Romanian struggle from 1924-83 led by St. Glicherie and St. Victor I consider St. Victor a saint but ROCOR/RTOC has made no effort to consider his sanctity as of yet. In my opinion this policy was not a mistake, but a serious transgression on the part of the ROCOR hierarchy and the laity who supported it or remained silent in the face of it.

It led to the uncanonical midnight ordination by this Romanian NC ROCOR bishop of Father Acacias Papas in Detroit in 1961.

St. John Maximovitch led the effort to accept the Romanian and Dutch NC Churches within ROCOR in the 1950's when he was Bishop of Paris and the Low Countries.

For those of you interested in ROCOR's decision in 1974 to clarify itself about the Council of 1667 and the Old Believer Schism, that information can be found at:

http://www.rocorstudies.org/2015/02/27/ ... -in-oregon

Scroll down to the Chapter title: "As If They Had Never Been" and there will be a copy of the 09-25-74 ukase from ROCOR on 1667 and the Old Believers.

It is a good example of repentance at the episcopal level for historical transgressions that continue to cause pain long after the initial trauma.

In addition information on Masonic influence within the Greek Church in the 19th and 20th centuries can be found at:

http://www.geopolitica.ru/en/article/in ... -ecumenism

The title and author: Influence of Freemasonry on Early Greek Ecumenism by Monk Seraphim Zissis

[Maria]

Here is the edit of the post that some of you objected to:

Archbishop Theophilius Ionescu was the NC Romanian Archbishop within ROCOR from the early 1950's to 1972 when he passed away. At the time of his inclusion in ROCOR (where among other things he served the NC community in Paris) St. Victor Leu was kidnapped in Vienna by the KGB and spent the next 26 years in the Soviet and Romanian Gulags. ST. Victor was ordained a bishop by ROCOR in the late 40's in Austria The full account of his life can be found at:

http://www.rocorstudies.org/2010/01/16/ ... ern-europe

The extensive comments posted at the end of his life provide more context

ROCOR did not publicly object to his (St. Victor's) kidnapping in 1952 but instead concentrated on the welfare of the New Calendar Romanians within ROCOR. This followed their policy of not supporting the OC Romanian struggle from 1924-83 led by St. Glicherie and St. Victor I consider St. Victor a saint but ROCOR/RTOC has made no effort to consider his sanctity as of yet. In my opinion this policy was not a mistake, but a serious transgression on the part of the ROCOR hierarchy and the laity who supported it or remained silent in the face of it.

It led to the uncanonical midnight ordination by this Romanian NC ROCOR bishop of Father Acacias Papas in Detroit in 1961.

St. John Maximovitch led the effort to accept the Romanian and Dutch NC Churches within ROCOR in the 1950's when he was Bishop of Paris and the Low Countries.

For those of you interested in ROCOR's decision in 1974 to clarify itself about the Council of 1667 and the Old Believer Schism, that information can be found at:

http://www.rocorstudies.org/2015/02/27/ ... -in-oregon

Scroll down to the Chapter title: "As If They Had Never Been" and there will be a copy of the 09-25-74 ukase from ROCOR on 1667 and the Old Believers.

It is a good example of repentance at the episcopal level for historical transgressions that continue to cause pain long after the initial trauma.

In addition information on Masonic influence within the Greek Church in the 19th and 20th centuries can be found at:

http://www.geopolitica.ru/en/article/in ... -ecumenism

The title and author: Influence of Freemasonry on Early Greek Ecumenism by Monk Seraphim Zissis

For both links, I got "page not found". Could you please provide another link?

Please try to avoid the use of ambiguous pronouns. I suppose you are referring to St. Victor above.

[Maria]

Here is the edit of the post that some of you objected to:

Archbishop Theophilius Ionescu was the NC Romanian Archbishop within ROCOR from the early 1950's to 1972 when he passed away. At the time of his inclusion in ROCOR (where among other things he served the NC community in Paris), St. Victor Leu was kidnapped in Vienna by the KGB and spent the next 26 years in the Soviet and Romanian Gulags. ST. Victor was ordained a bishop by ROCOR in the late 40's in Austria The full account of his life can be found at:

http://www.rocorstudies.org/2010/01/16/ ... ern-europe

The extensive comments posted at the end of his life provide more context

ROCOR did not publicly object to his (St. Victor's) kidnapping in 1952 but instead concentrated on the welfare of the New Calendar Romanians within ROCOR. This followed their policy of not supporting the OC Romanian struggle from 1924-83 led by St. Glicherie and St. Victor I consider St. Victor a saint but ROCOR/RTOC has made no effort to consider his sanctity as of yet. In my opinion this policy was not a mistake, but a serious transgression on the part of the ROCOR hierarchy and the laity who supported it or remained silent in the face of it.

It led to the uncanonical midnight ordination by this Romanian NC ROCOR bishop of Father Acacias Papas in Detroit in 1961.

St. John Maximovitch led the effort to accept the Romanian and Dutch NC Churches within ROCOR in the 1950's when he was Bishop of Paris and the Low Countries.

For those of you interested in ROCOR's decision in 1974 to clarify itself about the Council of 1667 and the Old Believer Schism, that information can be found at:

http://www.rocorstudies.org/2015/02/27/ ... -in-oregon

Scroll down to the Chapter title: "As If They Had Never Been" and there will be a copy of the 09-25-74 ukase from ROCOR on 1667 and the Old Believers.

It is a good example of repentance at the episcopal level for historical transgressions that continue to cause pain long after the initial trauma.

In addition information on Masonic influence within the Greek Church in the 19th and 20th centuries can be found at:

http://www.geopolitica.ru/en/article/in ... -ecumenism

The title and author: Influence of Freemasonry on Early Greek Ecumenism by Monk Seraphim Zissis

Yes, it is very strange that the ROCOR did not support St. Glicherie and St. Victor.

The ROCOR did not come to the help of the Greek Old Calendarists nor the Romanians. However, when the uncanonical midnight consecration of Father Acacias Papas was done in Detroit in 1961 without ROCOR synodal approval during Father's brief visit to the USA, then ROCOR rectified that consecration with nothing else than a simple piece of paper called a protocol.